Dana 30 narrow track |
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Speedy
Member Joined: 07 Apr. 2010 Location: Toronto Canada Status: Offline Points: 531 |
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Posted: 01 Feb. 2015 at 1:25am |
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I am trying to sort out my front axle. originally I purchased all new bearings and seals to rebuild my freshly painted dana 25 and dana 41 axle's the idea was to use the original ring and pinions tho they were slightly pitted.
I then had a fresh rebuild (in 1968 never used) dana 44 from a M38 work done by the RCEME (Royal Canadian Electrical and Mechanical Engineers) so I am saving myself the experience of rebuilding the Dana 41 and using this fresh Dana 44. now, the Dana 25 is on my bench just about ready for work but around 4 or more teeth are slightly pitted on the ring an pinion, and I contemplated getting rid of the bendix for the spicer axles although I am fine with the bendix on hand. now I have the option of picking up a Dana 30 narrow track axle with the 5.38 carrier as far as I know needs a complete rebuild, I know it will compliment the dana 44 in the rear nicely and I can then run disk brakes on the front (correct?). will I have to modify the steering? or can I retain the stock steering box with no issues?. I understand the axle is a few inches wider? I could make aluminum spacers with longer wheel studs for the rear. I know I invested allot of money for all the bearings and seals aswel as paint for the stock set up, but I am sure I can recoup. whats the smart way to go? originality is not a concern any longer as I am running the dana 44 and my body is a repop.
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- Mike
47 CJ2A - Warn OD, Ramsey PT1-J/Koenig 100,Arctic top,Dana 44 30 spline full float with disc's,Dana 30 with discs, 2.5 lift, Saginaw power steering, dual master cylinder |
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GARGOYLEJEEPER
Member Joined: 05 Oct. 2014 Location: Oregon Status: Offline Points: 235 |
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Keep the 1 piece rod on the 30 and run the other rod from the bell crank to the right 30 knuckle front hole.
Or put the discs on the 25. Either way you do it is not just a bolt & go deal. The stock MS will have a hard time with discs.
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1948 CJ-2A 232505
Just trying to fix the world one Jeep at a time. |
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Speedy
Member Joined: 07 Apr. 2010 Location: Toronto Canada Status: Offline Points: 531 |
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so as far as the axle it will be a bolt on and go leaf spring in the appropriate location, I just need to make my own steering rods? and I can utilize the stock ross steering box.
I had contemplated the dual master cylinder for safety reasons, so that is the only modification I would need to make?
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- Mike
47 CJ2A - Warn OD, Ramsey PT1-J/Koenig 100,Arctic top,Dana 44 30 spline full float with disc's,Dana 30 with discs, 2.5 lift, Saginaw power steering, dual master cylinder |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7982 |
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Be sure to get a MC that is designed for a Disc/Drum system and has the appropriate portioning valve. Other wise you will be skidding your rear brakes. As to the width difference. You can do as you have suggested with spacers or you can look for wheels with more backspace to suck your front tires in the inch or so on a side.
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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flatfender47
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Jan. 2006 Location: Riverside CA Status: Offline Points: 646 |
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Wheel Spacers for the rear.
Enjoy the tighter turning radius up front.
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GARGOYLEJEEPER
Member Joined: 05 Oct. 2014 Location: Oregon Status: Offline Points: 235 |
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If using the 25 w/disc remove & replace knuckle fill plug w/allen head and grind knuckle to fit caliper. If using the 30 use the 30 tie rods and make the short 1 to the box fit to the Jeep bell crank arm. Swap in a MS kit like Mark W. says. And check to see if your wheels clear the caliper because they may/may not clear. Proportioning valve and brake lines/hoses to match the MS to your brakes.
A used T90 main shaft or similar rod fits in side tie rod tube when shortening, so all you will need is a lathe or hacksaw/grinder and of course a welder. Measure/marks, scribe a straight line down the tube and cut & cut, insert align & weld.
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1948 CJ-2A 232505
Just trying to fix the world one Jeep at a time. |
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724wd
Member Joined: 15 Nov. 2014 Location: Spokane, WA Status: Offline Points: 83 |
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What is it about the wheels that might not fit? It's not the overall diameter, is it? don't most CJ-5 and such run 15" wheels?
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cpt logger
Member Joined: 23 Sep. 2012 Location: Western Colorad Status: Offline Points: 3040 |
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Bolding mine. Can we ASSuMe that (MS) actually means Master Cylinder (MC)? As in the brake Master Cylinder? The only MS that I know of is Multiple Sclerosis, which is not good, & has almost nothing to do with CJs.
Yes, The wheel Inside Diameter (ID), where the brake drum was and where the brake calipers are, may be too small. The wheels MAY rub on the disc brake calipers. Some times this can be avoided by using the correct 16" wheels. Some folks have ground lightly on the calipers casting to achieve the proper clearance. I am not a big fan of this. Grinding on the calipers casting can weaken them & cause problems down the road. If you are very sure that this will not be an issue, do so at your own risk. The 15" wheels were an option for the early CJs. The later CJ-5s did come with 15" wheels stock, & the 16" wheels were the option at that time. Note: My DJ-5C came with 14" wheels. IHTH, Cpt Logger. |
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GARGOYLEJEEPER
Member Joined: 05 Oct. 2014 Location: Oregon Status: Offline Points: 235 |
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Sorry I never took typing, so it is 1 letter at a time MC master cylinder. Old Jeeps never had discs so the wheels were never made for discs, and the 15" will not mount over the caliper unless they are spaced out. The last 1 I did was a 1966 CJ5 with 15"s and had to install a spacer, because he did not want to replace his wheels. And I ground the knuckles and the very edge of the calipers, on the calipers if you do not grind you have to take more off the knuckle. And you need to replace the pipe fill fitting from the weather head to a Allen head because that is were you grind. I have did many of these for the 25 & 27, and machined for bolts from the inside spindle mount, to make them studs. and longer lug bolts for the discs.
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1948 CJ-2A 232505
Just trying to fix the world one Jeep at a time. |
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cpt logger
Member Joined: 23 Sep. 2012 Location: Western Colorad Status: Offline Points: 3040 |
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Cool! Good info here. Don't most after market wheels fit with the disc brakes? I seem to recall that the wagon wheel style wheels will fit with disc brakes, as will many of the mag rims.
Could you explain to me why having the rear axle wider than the front axle is a problem? I would think that 2" difference would not be an issue. Thanks, Cpt Logger. |
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724wd
Member Joined: 15 Nov. 2014 Location: Spokane, WA Status: Offline Points: 83 |
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what is your opinion of this conversion?
http://www.fourwheeler.com/how-to/transmission-drivetrain/154-0704-early-jeep-disk-brake-conversion/ It would seem to me that the 1/2 ton GM calipers and caliper mounting brackets in conjunction with the CJ-5 discs would allow the use of 15" wheel. I had 15"ers on my '72 4x4 with discs. Am I thinking wrong? I hope not... |
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GARGOYLEJEEPER
Member Joined: 05 Oct. 2014 Location: Oregon Status: Offline Points: 235 |
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Yes, that is what I put on the guys `66 CJ5, and as you see the grind on the caliper to break the angle to the knuckle, if you do not take that edge off you will have to take off a lot more of the knuckle, and way into the seal area which is not good. Never take off more then is shown on the caliper, I do not care what people say about weakening the caliper it is not a problem and I have never seen or heard of a failure. Also notice that they just ground the fill plug to nothing, I get a Allen and a pipe die and cut the plug till it goes in deeper and grind the excess off the inside so it does not hit the axle. That axle must have newer Spicer sealed u-joints since lube fill will be a dismantle, instead of removing the caliper and fill. 1 thing they do not tell you is the Chevy hoses mount with bolt threads to the brake line mount and Jeeps used a clip, so you will need to source a 2 nuts for the end of the hoses. the good thing is Chevy parts are a lot easer to find & less $.
Non of the stock early 15" wheels will fit over the caliper, later years & aftermarkets you will have to fit to find out.
Edited by GARGOYLEJEEPER - 02 Feb. 2015 at 8:02pm |
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1948 CJ-2A 232505
Just trying to fix the world one Jeep at a time. |
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724wd
Member Joined: 15 Nov. 2014 Location: Spokane, WA Status: Offline Points: 83 |
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Thank you, that makes more sense now.
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Speedy
Member Joined: 07 Apr. 2010 Location: Toronto Canada Status: Offline Points: 531 |
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good info,
I know there must be a number of the membership that has done this conversion! more opinions would be great. I guess if I am going to rebuild the dana 25 id may as well do the 30 instead?
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- Mike
47 CJ2A - Warn OD, Ramsey PT1-J/Koenig 100,Arctic top,Dana 44 30 spline full float with disc's,Dana 30 with discs, 2.5 lift, Saginaw power steering, dual master cylinder |
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724wd
Member Joined: 15 Nov. 2014 Location: Spokane, WA Status: Offline Points: 83 |
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I've been going back and forth on that very question! Rebuilding and replacing the brakes on the 25 is currently winning out for me, as the 30's I've found locally need to be gone through as well. They may have the brakes already, but if you have to rebuild or replace calipers, new rotors if worn too far, axle u-joints, plus the necessity to find one with the same gear ratio as the rear... It's pointing to rebuilding our 25 and hunting the brake swap parts at the local pick n pull. D30 axles here seem to run about $200, and the rotors/calipers are highly suspect!
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