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"Improved" CJ2A Canvas Top

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar. 2017 at 3:45am
Jeff,
Thanks for posting the pictures of the Bat Wing doors.

These doors are designed using what is call Bio-Mimicry, using a bat wing as a design guide.  The idea was to create a door that could be fully deployed (spread) for heavy weather (photo 1) and a opened into a fully stored position (photo 5) when not in use as a door.   The upper portion could also be opened for venting (photo 4).


Photo 1 is of the finished drivers door.
Photo 2 is of the finished passenger door.
Photo 3 is of prototype test door.
photo 4 is of the prototype door with the upper portion open as a vent.
photo 5 is the prototype door in the stored position forward.

If you look at photo number 3 it shows the most structural detail.
1. There is a rope sewn into the edge of the door skin all of the way around the door.  This gives structure to the door skin and reduces flapping of the edge when driving down the road.
2. There are three battens sewn into the door.  The top batten is 1/2" wood dowel, the two bottom battens are fiberglass driveway markers from Home Depot with rubber caps on each end.
The top batten is centered on the upper door edge as close a possible to the top but still in side of the sewn rope edge.
The middle batten needs to touch the tub at the passengers elbow.  It should protrude beyond the tub by at least 1/2 inch.
The bottom batten should needs to touch the tub at the rear entry break  (see photo 3).  Again the batten should extend 1/2" pass the edge of the tub.
3. The top batten is exposed in middle so it can be secured to the door support with a "ball snugger".  The ball snugger can be see in picture number 3.
4.  The two lower battens are also secured with ball snuggers.   The finished doors have ball sunggers attached to the door about 2 inches above the door tub interface.  The lower one attaches to the seat frame.  The middle one to the field door support which is a tight bungee cord.
5.  The window is a sheet of 20 mil window vinyl with edge binding that was sewn on to the door skin.

If you want to make these doors this is the sequence I used to construct them:
1. Place a door frame on the fabric you are going to use to make the door.  Trace the outer door  shape on to the fabric making it about 3/8" larger than the door.  Then using a rule and an additional 2 inches of fabric beyond the door outline.  If you are using a 3A style attaching point draw a line along the attaching point and add 2 inches beyond the line.  For a 2A stlye door the attaching points are more challenging,  I recommend making a prototype door and not finishing the front door attaching point until you do a trial fit.  You can hang the back side of the door where it  belongs and design you front edge attaching point use either snaps, turn buckles or heavy Velcro for attaching points.  The Bat Wing doors in the photos are on a 3A windshield mounted a Cj2A.

2. Sew a piece of 3/8" hard / stiff nylon rope into the outer edge of the door folding the extra two inches of material you added to the door tracing line over the rope.  You need to position the rope so that when the skin is folded over the rope the tracing line will end up on the outer edge of the door skin edge.  Start sewing a the forward and inch shot bottom  forward edge of  the door and proceed clock wise towards the back of the Jeep if you are sewing the passenger door..  You want your stitches as close to the rope as possible to get a tight edge.  Only make one pass with the sewing machine.

3. Sew on the completed window.  I used two passes with the sewing machine.  Then removed the door skin from inside the window area. The cut line was about 5/16" inside the stitch attaching the window.

4. Lay the battens on to the door skin and make the center lines where each of the lower battens  will be placed.  Mark the top and bottom points where the batten touch the door edges.

5. Using the scrap from the material remove from the windows, fashion an upper pocket in the upper  forward edge of the door.  The out line for this pocket can be see in photo 1.  Tuck the pocket material under the loose flap beyond the door rope edge.  Note that the entire upper pocket is a single machine run.  Place some scrap batten material in the pocket in the exact place the finish batten will be inserted.  Start at the top if the door proceed along the out line of the  top batten about 4 inches.  Then down  to the window frame, long the frame to middle batten.  Up the middle batten, around the top, down the other side along the batten and then along the window frame to the bottom batten.  Follow along the bottom batten and finish by sewing along the rope edge until you reach the starting point of your stitch.
 
6. Fashion the rear top batten pocket in a similar fashion.  The pocket should only be 4 inches deep.  You will want the exposed bar at the top so you can button up the door in bad weather.

7.  Cut  two strips about 2 1/2" wide and 12 inches long to use as the bottom batten pockets.  The finished pockets as seen in photo 2, have a one inch slot down the middle to accept the batten.  Again, the outer edge of the batten pocket will be sewn under the rope edge flap.  See the photo for the finished shape.

8.  The door skins are now finished sewing.  Install the battens by cutting small slits about 3/4 of an inch from the top / forward end of the sewn batten pockets.  Slip the battens into their pockets.

9. Install the door on the Jeep.  Find the positions close to where the battens lay on to the tub and add one ball snugger per batten by cutting a small whole in the sewn on batten pocket and passing the bungee part of the snugger behind the batten and between the outer sink of the door.  Pull the bungee material all of the way though until the ball touches the batten pocket.


Let me know if you have any questions

Stev




Edited by Stev - 29 Mar. 2017 at 4:16am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ol' Unreliable Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar. 2017 at 4:18am
How well do the doors stay closed at speed or in a heavy crosswind?  Or both?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar. 2017 at 1:23pm
They should be great in heavy wind and rain.  The ones in the photo are attached to a channel along the windshield edge, then they are attached to the tub with a ball snugger at the ends of each batten and at the top edge.  The door also has a stiffing rope sewn into the edge all the way around to reduce edge flapping.  The doors skins over laps the tub, rear curtain and top edge by about an inch.  As the door is spread up wards it get gains structure like the spreading of a wing.

David will be driving from Detroit to Moab in early April which will be a good road and weather test for this system.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar. 2017 at 1:28pm
I wonder what clear acrylic or polycarbonate rods would look like. Not that you could see through them very well but they may look more attractive from the outside. An acrylic rod might be too brittle.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Mar. 2017 at 2:50pm
JPet,

I agree clear battens would look nice.   The batten material needs to be pretty stiff yet flexible enough to withstand the riggers of trail life.  Safety orange battens might look good on a safety orange top but not so much on the green top.

At one point I considered sewing a sleeve for them or just painting them to match the top - but ran out of time.  I have a set of 3A doors that have an exposed door frame rod that passes across the window like the battens do.  The doors have a canvas sleeve sewn on to the rod where it passed across the window.
  

The fiberglass rods are $1.99 each at Home Depot, until we figure something else out they are easy to acquire and cheap.

Thanks again for posting the photos!
  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Mar. 2017 at 3:25am
JPet,

I am considering ordering as set of 3A soft top mounting rails used on the windshield top and both sides to mount on my 1946 trail Jeeps 2A windshield and lower cowl.  The 3A slot for attaching the summer top and the front of the doors is  an excellent design.  I am sure people have done this to 2A windshields in the past.  I am considering making a second top like the one for David's Moab Trip.




Edited by Stev - 30 Mar. 2017 at 3:27am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Apr. 2017 at 5:30pm
I am assembling the materials to sew another one of these vinyl trail tops with the Bat Wind doors. Going to use a 3A windshield againand the roll bar as the middle bow.   This will be a 5 piece full top.

I did picked up an upper windshield rail from the M38 that the top slides into.  This the same rail used on the 3A windshields and down the sides of the door.  I am going with the idea of cutting some short sections of rail to make rail attaching points for the bottom edge of the side curtains.   

My thought is that the rails could be mounted along the side of tub above rear wheels.  The bottom edge of side curtains (which have rope sewn into them) could be slid into the rails and then upper edge of the side curtain could be zipped to the summer top like the top I did for David's Moab Trip.  Using rails on the side would eliminate the need for internal buckles (4 each at $3 per) and would cut down on the lower edge flapping.

The material cost to make one of these tops is:
$56 in Ebay military recycled tarp. (for 3 tarps)
$9 in Ebay military number 21 OD Thread (1 spool)
$18 in Ebay military sleeping bag zippers (for 2 zippers)
$18 in military surplus canvas straps with buckles and ends for the rear of the summer top (6 complete straps)
$2 in Ebay military surplus edge binding (one roll had about 100 yard on it for $13)
$10 in Home Depot drive way markers (for 4 fiberglass and 1 dowel) used in the door battens 
$10 in 20 mil window vinyl (for the doors and windows)
$4 in Home Depot rope
$30 for M38 top rail used on the rear tub to mounting the side curtains.

So that is something like $139 in materials if you use buckles on the side curtain or $157 if you use the M38 side rails to mount the side curtains.

Another 6 dollars in Conduit if you need to make a rear bow.




Edited by Stev - 06 Apr. 2017 at 12:31am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Apr. 2017 at 2:42pm
Early field test results from David's drive from Detroit to Moab.  He drove 14 hours (about 400 miles) in the rain yesterday.

I texted him to find out how the top and bat wing doors were working.  Here is what he wrote back:

"It was pouring hard"
"The top is such a godsend.
"I'm in Chillicothe Missouri"
"Actually, it rained all 14 hours I was driving yesterday."
"The doors keep the rain out at speed, no issue there".


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stude-a-willys Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 July 2017 at 9:21pm
I really dig the bat wing doors. Elegant engineering for sure. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bob3b Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 July 2017 at 1:15pm
I'm really looking forward to seeing the results of this post. I have it mind to make a 7 piece top for my 3b someday, one that I can convert into a half cab fairly easily.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Sep. 2019 at 5:43pm

This Soft Top project is live again.  Hope to have the new top sewn and ready to use on the October 2019 Ohio Fall Colors ride.  This is a Singer 145W304 - double needle canvas sewing machine that I am going to use along with the Singer 111-152 single needle machine.  Both machines have W serial numbers and the 145 used during WW2 in a canvas factory.   Cant wait to get started.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote timcj2a Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Sep. 2019 at 5:24am
Very cool.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep. 2019 at 2:54am

Some progress. 



Center seem - looking forward towards the front of the Jeep



Bow attachment points




Rear attachment for the duster.  Can be used to adjust for shrinkage top or fit.


Detail of rear bow attaching hook and loop



Detail of inner rear panel




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bobevans Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Sep. 2019 at 3:49am
Wow, that looks awesome.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SnorriS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Dec. 2021 at 6:42pm
So, how have you progressed in the last several years with your soft top design?
Those are the same basic parameters I would like to see with the addition of magnets in the edge hems to hold the material to the body. I have reached out to Jeff and he is working to get a new merger in place to maybe produce these. I wonder how you have come along and if there is a product on the market?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Dec. 2021 at 9:16am
No good excuse for letting life and other projects get in the way of this. One thing that would be nice to add to this project would be a design that could be quickly setup.  The historic CJ2A tops take a while to put up.  My dad told a story about how he  and his Jeep driver would keep the summer top attached to the MB's windshield edge and fold the top on or under windshield.  I think he said they could have it up in a  minute or so.  I will ask him if he remembers how they did that.  


Edited by Stev - 13 Dec. 2021 at 9:17am
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