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Help with poor braking
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    Posted: 24 Nov. 2014 at 5:51am
my 48 cj2a has poor braking and im trying to fix it but could use some opinions before I tackle it so I have a better idea where to check first. I know the factory 9 inch setup should work great because I have a 59 cj5 with all factory 9 inch drums and single master and it works freaking awesome can lock them up if I want which leads me to believe theres something wrong with the 48 cj2a.
 
my 48 with the poor braking has all new brakes. rear axle has new brake shoes and front are good used shoes, new lines, new calipers, 3 used 9 inch drums that have been slightly turned on a lathe and 1 brand new drum. new R&P dual master cylinder designed for 4 wheel drums with remote reservoirs on firewall for easy filling.
 
the brakes do work but I have to practically stand on them sometimes for hard braking and nowhere close to capable of locking up. good firm pedal feel. don't need to pump them. they just don't seem to stop well.
 
what I am thinking is the brake shoe adjustment might be my problem. I thought I had them adjusted well but the only thing I can think of causing my scenario would be only part of the shoes are hitting the drum, say for example only the top of the shoes are contacting the drum and not the bottom of the shoes? maybe I just have to re-do my "major" adjustment of the shoes?
 
any other ideas?
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Points: 1341 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 48willys Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov. 2014 at 12:22pm
Just a thought, but are the brake shoes installed right? Long shoe facing forward and the short one facing back, that can make a big difference. It sounds like you replaced just about everything, I'm guessing when you say "calipers" you meant wheel cylinders. The wheel cylinders come in two bore sizes, the large ones go on the front and small ones go on the back.
How did you do the major adjustment?
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I am pretty sure the shoes are installed longer pad on front. I remember making it opposite of what most cars are. Yes I meant wheel cylinders sorry for that, and when I installed them I went back to the computer to re - look up the part number at napa to make sure they were correct front and back. The major adjustment was done from feel adjusting top and bottom again and again until they felt right spinning the wheel but apparently somethings not right so I will have to double check everything.
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Points: 3400 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TERRY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Nov. 2014 at 2:53pm
Since these are not dual servo brakes, but have bottom ends fixed, adjustment for proper heel and toe clearance is absolutely necessary.
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You might need to adjust them again, try using a feeler gauge through the drum. Adjust to .008 at the top of the shoe and .005 at the bottom, I think my manuel says to adjust the top first then the bottom but I'm not sure on that as I don't have it with me.
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You say it has new brakes--Did you replace all the rubber lines? If not thats likely your issue. Old lines with swell with the pressure. Feels like you have good pedal but your just blowing up the lines rather than expanding the cylinder.
If a man says something in the garage - and his wife can't hear him - is he still wrong???
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All rubber is new. I will try and do what I can with feeler gauge but I think only my front have the slots for them. 1 rear drum is new and doesn't have slots and the other rear is off early cj5 with same 9 inch brakes since I drilled and tapped rear hubs to accept newer style bolt on drums with 3 small screws so I don't need hub puller for future brake service.
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I put together this sheet from the manual.
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Not having the slots makes the adjustment more difficult, but going back and forth between the heel and toe may help, but is frustrating. One could use a Dremel and make a slot.
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You didn't mention, is the new master cyl the same bore as the original. A bigger bore will require more pedal pressure to get the same braking power at the wheels.
 Ray
48 cj2a, 47 Cat d45t, 26 Dodge coupe 340-6pack, 63 Dodge M37, 52 GMC XM211, 70 Dodge Challenger 496-6pack
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One thing that could prevent accurate adjustment is oversize drums. These pivoting shoes can not achieve full contact on a drum that has been turned. In the old days shoes were reground to achieve an arc that would match the drum. Must have been a lot of asbestos in the air back then!
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Originally posted by TERRY TERRY wrote:

Must have been a lot of asbestos in the air back then!

There was, I breathed it in for 20+ years. When we had a brake job to do the first thing we did once the drums were off was to blow everything off with an air hose. Did the same for a clutch job. No one knew way back then (1950s-1970s). I'm on a watch for Meso and my name is already on the database should I develop symptoms. Ah, the good old days!
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I began tearing into brake adjustment for my Dana 25. Poked feeler gauge into slot in left front drum pulled it out covered in grease. Ok so there's A problem. May not be the problem. Pulled hub and drum off and yep it's all covered in fresh grease. Axle was just rebuilt this year new seals everything.

So now I have to find the problem whether it's inner hub seal. Or spindle seal surface is worn and needs new spindle.
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Tried to upload picture but it says my size is too big.
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Try webresizer.com to shrink the px.
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Originally posted by WorkInProgress WorkInProgress wrote:

Tried to upload picture but it says my size is too big.
 
 
I wish someone would say that to me LOL
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