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THE SILICONE MONSTER!! |
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Bruce W 
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Joined: 29 July 2005 Location: Northeast Colorado Status: Offline Points: 9653 |
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 Topic: THE SILICONE MONSTER!!Posted: 01 Sep. 2014 at 5:52am |
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THE SILICONE MONSTER'S BEEN IN HERE!!!!
That's what we used to hear in the shop when someone found a case of some DIY'er or other Bubba getting over-zealous with the silicone sealer tube and plugging up engine oil pump strainers, transmission filters, cylinder head oil drain holes, etc.
Oilleaker1, M38Mike, Jpet and others may remember the fuel delivery problems I had on the Black Hills Meet and the Northern Colorado Mountain Run. Something evidently blocking the fuel pickup in my tank. I learned that all I had to do was disconnect the fuel inlet line from the pump, connect a piece of vacuum hose to the flex line, and blow the obstruction out, and we'd be good for a while, until the offending piece of whatever found the pickup tube again.
Today, I siphoned the gas out of the tank with a 1/2 inch hose, with the RF wheel of the 2A up on a block, so the gas and debris would find the LR corner of the tank. I delivered the gas to a jerry can thru a funnel with a very fine brass screen in it. I collected a few fine pieces of what appeared to be paint chips in the screen. Shouldn't be there, but surely not the problem. The screen in the fuel pump should catch them, and they should not plug a line or the pickup. I poured the gas back into the jeep and siphoned it out again. More tiny paint chips, and a couple a little bigger, but nothing bigger than a pin-head. Then it occurred to me that this can is the same one that I poured fuel out of just before both occurrences of the problem, so I used a different funnel with a paint strainer to pour the gas back into the jeep, and caught more paint chips. I think the lining is coming out of the can, but I still don't think this is the problem.
Five times I siphoned the gas out of the jeep and poured it back in, on the sixth time, AHA!!
 Guess what? A chunk of black silicone sealer in my screen! THE SILICONE MONSTER'S BEEN IN HERE!!
 How did it get in the tank? Maybe someone used silicone to seal the gauge unit, or the drain plug. I bought this tank used and the gauge unit was in it when I got it, so I just left it alone.
I siphoned the gas out and poured it back again four more times, and even the paint chips stopped appearing, except in the paint strainer used when pouring the gas from the jerry can back into the jeep tank.
 I guess I'll stop using that can until I can get it cleaned out and maybe relined.
I'm pretty sure that piece of silicone was the culprit that was blocking the pickup tube in the tank. We'll find out in about three weeks. I'm still going to keep my 7/16 wrench and my piece of vacuum hose handy, though.  BWEdited by Bruce W - 01 Sep. 2014 at 5:58am |
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It is NOT a Jeep Willys! It is a Willys jeep.
Happy Trails! Good-bye, Good Luck, and May the Good Lord Take a Likin' to You! We Have Miles to Jeep, Before We Sleep. |
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willys54wagon
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Joined: 24 July 2008 Location: Ames, IA Status: Offline Points: 1444 |
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Posted: 01 Sep. 2014 at 1:35pm |
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Bruce,
A related question. I am working on the willys wagon, have the gas tank sand blasted and it looks nice and clean in there. Should I bother to line it with POR15? Seems like the liners cause more problems
Also, what sealant should be used for sealing the sending unit?
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Two jeeps on the road, one is close and the rest are dreams.
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Bruce W
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Joined: 29 July 2005 Location: Northeast Colorado Status: Offline Points: 9653 |
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Posted: 01 Sep. 2014 at 4:25pm |
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If the tank is nice and clean inside, maybe even a slight bit if surface rust (SLIGHT!), and doesn't leak, I think I'd run it as is. I'm a little leery of the sealers too, I hear of them coming loose, and I'm afraid of it plugging the pickup tube. Use good gas and use it often, or keep the tank full when not in use. I'm afraid there's always going to be some water in our tanks, but small amounts (a drop or two at a time) can be sucked up and run thru the carb and burned. I'm still not sure about the effects and remedies associated with the damd ethanol, but I think that if the fuel is kept fresh, full, and used, the problem of it absorbing water from the air can be minimized, and it might actually help by absorbing small bits of water that we're likely to have anyway. MO, YMMV, If anyone has any good knowledge in agreement or otherwise, I'd love to hear it.
As for sealer for the tank sending unit, I think a good gasket with a light smear of good ol' Permatex #2 would be good. And yes, a good, fuel-resistant silicone product, in a light smear would probably be alright. I use it in some places, it can be great stuff, but too much, or used in the wrong place, it can cause more trouble than help. Again, MO BW Edited by Bruce W - 01 Sep. 2014 at 4:31pm |
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It is NOT a Jeep Willys! It is a Willys jeep.
Happy Trails! Good-bye, Good Luck, and May the Good Lord Take a Likin' to You! We Have Miles to Jeep, Before We Sleep. |
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Bruce W
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Joined: 29 July 2005 Location: Northeast Colorado Status: Offline Points: 9653 |
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Posted: 02 Oct. 2014 at 4:01am |
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Once again, the SILICONE MONSTER rears his ugly, stinking, black head.
The first day of the Fall Color Tours, Uncle Lynden went almost two miles before beginning to buck, act like he was sick, then finally quit.  I got out my handy wrench and my vacuum hose, blew out the line (it seemed as tho it took a lot of pressure to break the plug free), and continued on. About two miles later it happened again. After blowing the line again, I made it to the gas station and filled up. At this point, Mike and I decided it would be best to return Uncle Lynden to the Thirsty Dirt Ranch for the day. All the way back, it ran fine, and this convinced me that whatever was causing the problem must float, as there was less than two gallons of fuel in the tank before I filled it. After a fun day of riding with Wally and Audrey, I set out to find the problem. Again, I siphoned the gas out thru a 1/2 inch hose, thru a paint strainer, and when I could not siphon the last bit out, I pulled the drain plug and drained the rest, thru the paint strainer. I caught some more paint chips (if that's what they actually were) and some dirt off of the outside bottom of the tank or tub. Now we jacked up the left front wheel to make sure that all the gas would find the drain, in the RR corner of the tank. We poured some of the filtered gas into the tank and let it run out the drain, collecting it in a clean drain pan. A few more paint chips, nothing more. We did this 3-4 times, then I put the plug back in, poured about a gallon of clean gas in, and took a fast pass around Old Ranch Loop. When I got back, we jacked up the LF wheel again and drained the gas once more. AHA! In the drain pan was a piece of black silicone sealer about the size and shape of a pencil eraser. The flat end of it was the mirror image of the shape of the end of a bolt. Puzzling, as the only bolts in the tank are the ones holding the gauge unit in, and they're much smaller than that. I laid the chunk of trouble-maker on Mike's tool box and showed it to several people that night and the next day. Uncle Lynden ran fine all the rest of the week, with nary a hiccup. When I went to show someone the piece of silicone late in the week, it had shrunk to the size of a BB when it dried out. About the size of the end of a gauge-unit screw. Long story - sorry, but I wanted to show you all how a small bit of this stuff in the wrong place can cause BIG problems. It's great stuff when used in the right places, in the proper amount, but it is NOT a universal, miracle, do-everything-better product. Thanks for reading. BW
Edited by Bruce W - 02 Oct. 2014 at 4:05am |
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It is NOT a Jeep Willys! It is a Willys jeep.
Happy Trails! Good-bye, Good Luck, and May the Good Lord Take a Likin' to You! We Have Miles to Jeep, Before We Sleep. |
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scoutpilot
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Joined: 30 Dec. 2008 Location: Asheboro, NC Status: Offline Points: 4373 |
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Posted: 02 Oct. 2014 at 10:06am |
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Keep this up and Bubba won't have any tools.
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mullen46cj2a
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Sponsor Member x 2 Joined: 19 July 2005 Location: Harrisville, WV Status: Offline Points: 1185 |
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Posted: 02 Oct. 2014 at 11:51am |
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"When I went to show someone the piece of silicone late in the week, it had shrunk to the size of a BB when it dried out. About the size of the end of a gauge-unit screw."
Certain elastomers will swell when exposed to petroleum products. Some will get very soft and gummy. Shrinking back to original size indicates the sealer is not petroleum resistant. I checked my chemical resistance reference and silicone is good for lubricating oils but not refined gasoline. Another sealer I have seen used is Butyl (commonly used for windshield installation) and it is not suitable for use with refined gasoline.
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Bruce Mullen Harrisville, WV
46 CJ2A column shift SOLD 07-15 48 CJ2A with Newgren lift 55 CJ5 |
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Oilleaker1
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Joined: 06 Sep. 2011 Location: Black Hills, SD Status: Offline Points: 4412 |
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Posted: 02 Oct. 2014 at 2:29pm |
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I better remember to look inside my gas tank you borrowed to drain your tank into. I might introduce some into mine--------LOL. I've been out in the woods cutting firewood with my Dodge M37 and discovered the previous owner did the same as yours. The silicone was about 6 inches long and sucked up the tank pickup tube and even turned a 90 degree corner. Looked like a earthworm. I put it on the cab floor and the next day it looked like sewing thread. Though I had it fixed and it did it again. I went fishing and found the rest. No problem since. Was a hoot traveling in the mountains with you Bruce! John
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Green Disease, Jeeps, Old Iron!
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Grey
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Joined: 19 Oct. 2014 Location: Mass Status: Offline Points: 180 |
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Posted: 20 Oct. 2014 at 3:17am |
Caswell's epoxy sealer. The last you will ever use. http://www.caswellplating.com/restoration-aids/epoxy-gas-tank-sealer.html |
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johnnybravo
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Joined: 14 Feb. 2008 Location: Glen Lyn, VA Status: Offline Points: 2075 |
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Posted: 20 Oct. 2014 at 1:04pm |
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You mentioned "Jerry can". Those participles look like the lining from a water can, not a fuel can. Can you post a photo of the suspect can.
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Ret. USAR-Vet, 6-GPW's,, 1-M38 w/M-100, 1-47 WO "Jeep" 4X2 Wagon, several ruff CJ2&3A's, 1-CJ3B,
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Bruce W
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Joined: 29 July 2005 Location: Northeast Colorado Status: Offline Points: 9653 |
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Posted: 20 Oct. 2014 at 5:17pm |
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I know the difference between a gas can and a water can. This can, and others I have seen, have what looks like a coat of paint inside. BW
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It is NOT a Jeep Willys! It is a Willys jeep.
Happy Trails! Good-bye, Good Luck, and May the Good Lord Take a Likin' to You! We Have Miles to Jeep, Before We Sleep. |
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johnnybravo
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Joined: 14 Feb. 2008 Location: Glen Lyn, VA Status: Offline Points: 2075 |
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Posted: 20 Oct. 2014 at 5:22pm |
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I have not seen the white inside. Sounds bad.
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Ret. USAR-Vet, 6-GPW's,, 1-M38 w/M-100, 1-47 WO "Jeep" 4X2 Wagon, several ruff CJ2&3A's, 1-CJ3B,
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Bruce W wrote: