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tie rods |
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harry E 
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Joined: 23 Nov. 2013 Location: Johnstown, NY Status: Offline Points: 137 |
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 Topic: tie rodsPosted: 30 Aug. 2016 at 4:05pm |
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will the tie rods from a early 1970s cj5 with saganaw steering work on a cj3a dana 25 front axel? i am starting to colect some parts for a steering conversion.
thanks for any help. Harry |
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Harry Eisenhauer
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48cj2a
Bantam Trailer Moderator 
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Posted: 30 Aug. 2016 at 5:56pm |
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There was a conversion AA offered to remove the 3 piece tie rods and replace it with a two piece that was used later on the CJ5s. A single rod tied the two steering knuckles together and a single rod went up to the pitman arm.
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Art C USAF (Retired)
47 CJ2A #134955 Project 48 CJ2A #206759 62 L6226 Station Wagon #58167 10900 45 T3-C #191 Project http://www.bantamt3c.com http://www.48cj2a.com |
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oldtime
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Joined: 12 Sep. 2009 Location: Missouri Status: Online Points: 4184 |
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Posted: 31 Aug. 2016 at 1:06am |
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No the CJ's with factory Saginaw all used a Dana 30.
Besides the standard split tie rod configuration the Dana 25 and Dana 27 axles can be set up with 2 different tie rod systems. One as Art has described the other makes use of a doulble hole steering knuckle. The double hole knuckle system is somewhat superior to te single tie rod using the standard rod ends. Double hole knuckles to fit D25/D27 can be sourced from Wllys wagons and trucks. The actual length of tie rod that's is required will vary between all these various steering configurations. I can supply the various actual tie rod lenghts if requested. System 1) Standard two piece tie rod (slit at bellcrank) For D25 and D27 axles System 2) Single piece tie rod using standard rod ends. For D25 and D27 axles System 3) Single piece tie rod using double knuckle. For D25 and D27 axles System 4) Single piece tie rod. For D30 narrow track axles. System 5) Single piece tie rod. For D30 wide track axles.
Edited by oldtime - 31 Aug. 2016 at 3:40pm |
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Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
T98-A Rock Crawler using exclusive factory parts and Approved Special Equipment from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963) Zero aftermarket parts |
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oldtime
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Posted: 31 Aug. 2016 at 3:41pm |
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System 2) = 35-14"
System 3) = 38-1/4" System 4) = 40-1/;2"
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Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
T98-A Rock Crawler using exclusive factory parts and Approved Special Equipment from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963) Zero aftermarket parts |
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berettajeep
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Posted: 01 Sep. 2016 at 2:37am |
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Ken, Would you happen to have part numbers for each one?
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oldtime
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Posted: 01 Sep. 2016 at 3:37pm |
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I have the tie rod part # for Dana 30 narrow track axles.
# 5350586 Technically the single piece Dana 25/27 tie rods are not Jeep parts. They are aftermarket. I got mine many years ago when Advance Adapters and 4Wheel Parts Wholesalers used to sell them in the 1970's and early 80's.
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Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
T98-A Rock Crawler using exclusive factory parts and Approved Special Equipment from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963) Zero aftermarket parts |
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Stev
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Posted: 12 July 2021 at 2:56pm |
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Oldtime,
On option #2 what is the length of the rod that goes from the bell crank to the double hole tie rod end on the passenger side? Are either of the existing (OEM) tubes usable as the rod front the bell crank to the double hole tie rod end that mounts in the 35.25" long tube in option #2 Thanks!
Edited by Stev - 12 July 2021 at 3:03pm |
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Stev
1946 CJ2A Trail Jeep (The Saint), 1948 CJ2A Lefty Restored |
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oldtime
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Posted: 12 July 2021 at 3:29pm |
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If you have Ross steering box and standard bell-crank with a D25/27 front axle along with double knuckle, then you need……
Custom length 38-1/4” tie rod along with a standard 21” connect rod (from bell-crank to double knuckle). This system nearly eliminates all possible death wobble because you are eliminating the standard split tie rod system. The double knuckle arm itself increases the steering leverage. So in effect you go from a standard steering ratio of 14/1 to become in effect a 25/1 steering ratio which is the same ratio as manual Jeep Saginaw box that was used on the 1972 and later CJ’s. I currently have this exact system installed on my final 134 build. BBCode Edited by oldtime - 12 July 2021 at 3:37pm |
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Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
T98-A Rock Crawler using exclusive factory parts and Approved Special Equipment from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963) Zero aftermarket parts |
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Stev
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Posted: 12 July 2021 at 3:48pm |
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I have standard knuckles. Any idea how long the shorter rod needs to be. It would go from the bellcrank to the double tie rod end mounted in the passenger side steering knuckle.
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Stev
1946 CJ2A Trail Jeep (The Saint), 1948 CJ2A Lefty Restored |
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oldtime
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Posted: 12 July 2021 at 3:49pm |
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And if you wanna really push the limits with a Ross system; this legal device almost makes it feel like power steering.
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Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
T98-A Rock Crawler using exclusive factory parts and Approved Special Equipment from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963) Zero aftermarket parts |
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oldtime
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Posted: 12 July 2021 at 3:52pm |
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As previously stated standard 21”.
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Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
T98-A Rock Crawler using exclusive factory parts and Approved Special Equipment from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963) Zero aftermarket parts |
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Stev
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Posted: 12 July 2021 at 4:10pm |
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Just to confirm ---"If you have Ross steering box and standard bell-crank with a D25/27 front axle along with double knuckle, then you need……
Custom length 38-1/4” tie rod along with a standard 21” connect rod (from bell-crank to double knuckle)." I don't have a Double knuckle just stock single hole knuckle. I was assuming it would be sometihing like 2" shorter. Thanks!
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Stev
1946 CJ2A Trail Jeep (The Saint), 1948 CJ2A Lefty Restored |
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oldtime
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Posted: 12 July 2021 at 4:41pm |
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Oh I see.
Somehow I thought you had a double knuckle to install. So what you have is the standard split tie rod system. I believe the standard split system was the result of original military stipulations to keep the GVW as low as possible; under 2000 lbs. Well regardless of why they split the tie rod you will need a rod that is shorter than 21” because you will be using the special “double tie rod end” on the passenger side. Sorry but i don’t have any of the standard passenger side split tie rods to measure the exact length. But yes it’s somewhere around 19” long. If you need one just post a WTB …. someone will have a spare standard short passenger rod.
Edited by oldtime - 12 July 2021 at 4:48pm |
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Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
T98-A Rock Crawler using exclusive factory parts and Approved Special Equipment from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963) Zero aftermarket parts |
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duffer
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Posted: 12 July 2021 at 9:31pm |
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When I was running the D25 in my 3B, I just bought the NT D30 tie rod Ken referenced and an 11/16-18 tap. I determined the length that needed trimmed and then ran the tap in using the existing threads to guide it. This put the thread depth below what I removed and I trimmed it to length. Then I ran the tap in again to the depth of the TRE threads, slotted the end for the clamping sleeve and again cleaned up the threads with the tap. This was all on the right hand threaded end. That lasted almost four decades until the D25 got replaced.
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1955 3B: 441sbc,AGE 4 speed transmission, Teralow D18w/Warn OD, 4.11:1 D44's/ARB's, glass tub & fenders, aluminum hood/grill, 8274, York OBA, Premier Power Welder; 67 CJ5: 225,T86AA, D18, 4.88's, OD
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rocnroll
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Posted: 12 July 2021 at 11:58pm |
.....This.....  |
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'47 CJ2A PU
'48 CJ2A Lefty "Common sense is not that common" |
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Mark W.
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Posted: 13 July 2021 at 8:44am |
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Brody/suicide knob not legal in Oregon and many other states one a vehicle driven on the road.
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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bight
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Posted: 13 July 2021 at 10:10am |
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not intending to stir the poop, and one should always question what is on the internetsphere but:
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CJ-2A 197624 green (resto-mod) the wife abides (def: to bear patiently; TOLERATE) |
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cpt logger
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Posted: 13 July 2021 at 9:41pm |
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While some folks, like quoted in the above post, say suicide knobs are not illegal, many LEOs seem to think otherwise. Many judges agree with the LEOs. I only have antidotes to support this claim. I have been harassed about them in California, Oregon, Idaho, Nevada, & Montana. The cops in New Mexico did not harass me but they did say that they were illegal there. I have not used one here in Colorado. My friends & relatives in many states have been issued tickets for the practice. These were mostly issued east of The Great Divide. Of course, YMMV.
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duffer wrote: