Snowback Build |
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Memphis
Member Joined: 04 Nov. 2019 Location: Canada Ontario Status: Offline Points: 8 |
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Posted: 21 Jan. 2020 at 12:15am |
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So guys updates, and a little help before I make a mistake. I decided my axle width will be 58" WMS in the front. I will not be outboarding the leaf springs. I will be building a passenger drop HP44 to bronco width.
From my measurements the front diff housing "side to side" will almost fall in place of the OE Dana 25. Bronco short side shaft is 18.32" which is almost identical to a chevy short side at 18.33" Running a longer inner on the right side will push the housing over a touch but I won't have to weld to the cast housing to mount my leaf spring unless someone has some suggestions for that? If a Narrow Track Dana 30 is a bolt in affair I have the following specs: Bronco Long Axle 27.94" Short Axle 18.32" 58" WMS CJ NT Long Axle 27.02" Short Axle 14.14" 53" WMS Scout Long Axle 32.91" Short Axle 14.78" 58" WMS So by that rough math I'll be 2.5" wider per side than a narrow track D30. The diff housing will be tucked into the frame more by approximately 2" I would say? Whereas if I narrowed to scout width the housing would be under the frame rail? Does that make sense? I'm worried my driveshaft will hit the transmission or oil pan but I don't have it mocked up to check.
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Memphis
Member Joined: 04 Nov. 2019 Location: Canada Ontario Status: Offline Points: 8 |
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I thought there was a printable file? It doesn't really matter I guess, I'll be transferring it to an MDF form because this will be one time use for me. I'll post some pics but I've started my HP D44 narrowing, removing the C's is a pain in the rear, I had to grind all the way through. The C's on the axle are junk so no big loss.
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jpet
Moderator Group Sponsor Member x 5 Joined: 30 Apr. 2008 Location: Ramsey, IL Status: Offline Points: 11173 |
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CJ2A #29110 "General Willys"
MB #204827 "BAM BAM" "We do what we can, and we try what we can't" |
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Memphis
Member Joined: 04 Nov. 2019 Location: Canada Ontario Status: Offline Points: 8 |
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Hey JPet, would you be interested in sending me your hammer form documents??
I have a tub to destroy
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Bob W
Member Sponsor Member x 4 Joined: 08 Aug. 2005 Location: Monticello, NY Status: Offline Points: 1689 |
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That is always a problem. Still trying to figure a way around it!!!
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7923 |
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I have CJ-5 springs under CHUG A LUG and they do give a nice ride compared to the shorter stock springs on a 2A or 3A. That said to put them on a 2A or 3A frame means you have to move the shackle mounts and spring hangers to keep the axles centered. I can't tell you how much as I also have a CJ5 frame under CHUG that has now been cut down in the back to fit. As I am not on the road yet I can't report on how my new springs behave. Heck I bought them over 12 years ago so I am not even sure from who. (LONG PROJECT).
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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jpet
Moderator Group Sponsor Member x 5 Joined: 30 Apr. 2008 Location: Ramsey, IL Status: Offline Points: 11173 |
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When I watch Ron (willyTJ) drive fritz with YJ springs, he looks very flexible and very comfortable. His performance is the same as all of us.
That being said, I don’t like being dashed back and forth in a rock garden and more flexible springs along with low gearing help a lot with that. |
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CJ2A #29110 "General Willys"
MB #204827 "BAM BAM" "We do what we can, and we try what we can't" |
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jpet
Moderator Group Sponsor Member x 5 Joined: 30 Apr. 2008 Location: Ramsey, IL Status: Offline Points: 11173 |
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The Walcks replacement springs are pretty good.
Local spring shops will make stock springs for around $150 per corner |
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CJ2A #29110 "General Willys"
MB #204827 "BAM BAM" "We do what we can, and we try what we can't" |
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smfulle
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 16 Sep. 2010 Location: Ogden, Utah Status: Offline Points: 6123 |
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The no one makes "good" stock springs is probably kinda true. I'm sure one could pay some high dollars for a spring shop to custom make some "stock" springs that are better than the off-the-shelf brands. i know that my attitude is different than a lot of guys. I have Crown replacements on all four corners and after a few years of pounding the rocks I've had to replace them due to sag or bending. I think if I were just driving it to the show and shine they would never be an issue, but hard driving is the fun for me so replacing parts is part of the deal. i'd rather replace the cheaper ones than the high dollar ones. Your build is going to be different than mine so a different set up might be better for you. I probably shouldn't comment on these modified threads since my experience is exclusively with locker/stocker class. And I'm a bit of a snob about it.
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jpet
Moderator Group Sponsor Member x 5 Joined: 30 Apr. 2008 Location: Ramsey, IL Status: Offline Points: 11173 |
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Sometimes I'm leary on getting into these conversations since there is really no right or wrong answers, but since you mentioned me specifically, I'll comment. These comments are based on the "Super Stock" criteria which means smaller skinny tires, 80” wheelbase.
If you want the same thing you see in our YouTube videos, all a super stocker "needs" is a stock set of springs, or maybe a set of early CJ5 springs. From my observation, The longer and more flexible springs are WAY more comfortable and look awesome in a "flex photo", but the flexibility can be detrimental because the transfer of weight to the wheels is not always there and with longer springs, the spring hangers are out in the kill zone. One disadvantage about shorter stock springs, or just being stiffer in general, is that it is harder on your frame and other structural components. Over time, I have slowly shortened the length of my springs. Even though I am not as flexible as I was, I feel that my capability is improving for the above reasons. … but I have also noticed that my frame, spring hangers, e.t.c. are under more stress than they were. My frame has been bent and repaired at every single hanger. I never had that when my springs were longer. Compromises I guess, right Bob? In the end, I'll take performance over comfort and repairs. WillyTJ has YJ springs on his flatty "Fritz". You might shoot him a PM. Again, I'm no expert on suspension, but I am an expert on the videos you are watching. Edited by jpet - 06 Dec. 2019 at 3:11pm |
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CJ2A #29110 "General Willys"
MB #204827 "BAM BAM" "We do what we can, and we try what we can't" |
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Memphis
Member Joined: 04 Nov. 2019 Location: Canada Ontario Status: Offline Points: 8 |
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Pretty sure the 2.2 is toast, the carburetor was left exposed to the elements for God knows how long and I drained a bunch of water out of the sump. Trans and Tcase saw the same elements and I am sure they are not much better.
My question about the spring width is because I have watched so many videos of your jeep, JP and Metcalf and they all seem to work so well. One point that was made on PBB was that companies that make "good" springs don't really exist for the CJ market now so YJ's are a good compromise
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smfulle
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 16 Sep. 2010 Location: Ogden, Utah Status: Offline Points: 6123 |
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I don’t know anything about spring theory and I really couldn’t wrench my way out of a wet paper bag, but I have wheeled my stock suspension a lot in the last few years while in the company if people with non-stock suspensions. Except for the obvious advantage in SOME instances that a lifted suspension can give one, I have not observed any advantage to non stock springs and in some cases the stiffness of te non stock springs was a huge disadvantage. Your mileage may vary.
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Memphis
Member Joined: 04 Nov. 2019 Location: Canada Ontario Status: Offline Points: 8 |
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One question I have and can't figure out. Is it better to run narrow 1.75" factory leaf springs or would I have a strong/positive increase in performance running say YJ leaf springs at 2.5"?
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Ol' Unreliable
Member Joined: 25 Sep. 2016 Location: CO Springs CO Status: Offline Points: 4226 |
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Were it me, I'd use the engine and running gear from the CJ-5 under the flattie body (please don't cut the hood--you can find a short carb somewhere). That would be the easiest and quickest way to a driver. Once you're mobile, drive it and ponder on what would be better (hint: not much, unless you wanna be a wild man).
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There's a reason it's called Ol' Unreliable
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Memphis
Member Joined: 04 Nov. 2019 Location: Canada Ontario Status: Offline Points: 8 |
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I'm doing the math on Spicers page: 5.86 Gears 1:1 final drive 34" tires 2500 RPM =43MPH If I have to regear, I'll be using something smaller |
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AKoller
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 19 Sep. 2018 Location: Moundridge Kans Status: Offline Points: 647 |
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You might be from The Great White North if you use zamboni axles in a Jeep build.....
Welcome to the page and best of luck to you on your build.
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1950 CJ3A "Thumper"
1966 M151 A1 1942 GPW #70221 |
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bobevans
Member Joined: 31 July 2005 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Status: Offline Points: 844 |
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And Welcome to the page!
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'48 CJ2A
'56 DJ3A '79 CJ7 And two of them actually run! |
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bobevans
Member Joined: 31 July 2005 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Status: Offline Points: 844 |
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Nothin' screams cool like Zamboni axles!!
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'48 CJ2A
'56 DJ3A '79 CJ7 And two of them actually run! |
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