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WellFedHobo's '48 CJ2A project (#158011)

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Bruce W View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce W Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jan. 2024 at 7:10pm
  Concentrate on the drive side pattern and don’t worry about the coast side so much. If neither pattern runs off any edge of the teeth, you’ll probably be alright. 
  When I was doing this professionally, pickups seemed to be the least trouble, vans were the worst. Suburbans almost as bad as vans, followed by station wagons. Guess why?
BW 
It is NOT a Jeep Willys! It is a Willys jeep.

Happy Trails! Good-bye, Good Luck, and May the Good Lord Take a Likin' to You!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WellFedHobo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Feb. 2024 at 7:21pm
I'm finally getting back around to finishing the rear axle rebuild. It's only taken around 6 months at this point to have the time and brain power. I think the pattern is as dialed in as it's going to get. The pattern most closely resembles the following:



I spent too much time obsessing over getting it perfectly centered on both the drive and coast sides. Just not possible.

I was about to put the yoke on for the last time and found that I had somehow dinged the end of the pinion and jacked up the threads, just in time for final reassembly. So that means I have a 3/4-20 rethreading die on the way now. (Luckily Amazon was offering overnight shipping on those for some reason. I'll take it.)

New bearings are on the new axle shafts, shims and bearing retainers are ready to reinstall on the flanges. Just needs the pumpkin to be finalized and I can finish it. 

I had ordered a new dust shield long ago and was installing it on the new-to-me yoke (thanks Rodney) but found that it was the wrong dust shield. It was definitely a Dana 18 dust shield. I tried the Bubba method of modifying it: hammering it flat and reshaping it. But like most Bubba fixes, it didn't work out right in the end. No one seems to sell the right dust shield these days. Hopefully the felt seal in its metal retainer will be enough. I'm definitely tired of this rebuild dragging on so long and would like the thing to be installed on the Jeep so I can drive without the rear axle growling at me constantly.

And to think, I have at least one axle and potentially three axles left to rebuild after this...
Brad
1948 CJ2A #158011 "Sunk Cost Fallacy"
1945 T3-C #1431
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WellFedHobo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb. 2024 at 11:53am
The rethreading die did the trick but I don't have a good solution for the pinion dust cover on the yoke so I may have to just rob the one off the other axle. Has anyone seen any vendors that sell the actual correct style dust cover and felt insert? Ron Fitzpatrick has D18 ones on his rear axle page and they're the wrong ones, just too small to go over the end of the axle. Kaiser Willys sells some generic universal ones that don't have a properly sized felt seal or the dust cover itself. (And I tried one of those new style pinion seals, the red ones, and they're junk. Got some original style ones instead.)

Got both new axle shafts installed but I'm having an issue getting the end play set up. This should be the easy end part of the rebuild, I would think. Both sides are at 0.010+. The short side was hanging out pretty badly at 0.065 until I pulled the long side out a little so I could tap the short side in more. I assume it's just a matter of tapping the races in just a little more with a brass punch until the end play is 0.003-0.007 per the manual. (The spec for this is hiding in the wheel section, not the axle section.) 

[edit] I actually just realized that I didn't have the short side fully tightened down, it was just hand tight. That's probably why my end play was not right. I bet it'll be near correct once I go over last night's work and actually tighten everything up before I try to check end play. Embarrassed And maybe hold off on the frosty beverages until after the job is done.




Edited by WellFedHobo - 25 Feb. 2024 at 12:44pm
Brad
1948 CJ2A #158011 "Sunk Cost Fallacy"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Beach Bum Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb. 2024 at 12:27pm
You are incorrect in most everything you have stated regarding end play. Check out Metalshaper’s You Tube video on the subject. Pictures are worth a whole lot and will be much easier to understand than if one of us tried to explain with typed words only.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WellFedHobo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb. 2024 at 12:32pm
Originally posted by Beach Bum Beach Bum wrote:

You are incorrect in most everything you have stated regarding end play. Check out Metalshaper’s You Tube video on the subject. Pictures are worth a whole lot and will be much easier to understand than if one of us tried to explain with typed words only.

Strange. He says 0.001-0.006 of end play. But the Holy Service Manual, which everyone says to read and follow, says 0.003-0.007 on page O-2. So who is right?
Brad
1948 CJ2A #158011 "Sunk Cost Fallacy"
1945 T3-C #1431
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Beach Bum Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb. 2024 at 1:38pm
Maybe I missed something, I see where he says 10 thou each side (both sides should be exactly the same because for this purpose the axle(s) can be considered 1 solid piece going all the way through. I also see that he says that you would use a brass punch to move the races in to reduce end play. Not true, the shims serve that purpose and the race should actually be “floating” in the housing, not requiring force to move them in. The exact numbers 0.001-0.006 or 0.003-0.007 was not my point. My point was about how you go about achieving the end play you want. Maybe I missed something (or several something’s) but that’s how I read it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WellFedHobo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb. 2024 at 1:50pm
This is my first axle rebuild so I'm not sure that I'm not doing something wrong, ie maybe I hammered the race in too far on one side without having the other side mostly in place first? (On the long side, the race was actually below flush with the flanged surface which didn't seem right, and when I put the short side in, the bearing and race stuck out really far, so I pulled the long shaft out a little (by pulling the race out past the flange) which allowed me to put the short shaft in further and get the bearing cone fully into the axle (as if I had the long side in too far such that it was putting pressure on the spider gears and pushing them over? They're Omix replacement spider gears so who knows if they're even right. I don't know, as I am figuring all of this out piece by piece. No local mentors, no local shops who will touch anything this old :/) 
Brad
1948 CJ2A #158011 "Sunk Cost Fallacy"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SE Kansas 46 CJ-2A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb. 2024 at 3:49pm
The axle shafts rest against the differential cross shaft. There really isn't any way to put "pressure on the spider gears and push[ing] them over". There isn't a lot of difference in 0.001-0.006 or 0.003-0.007. as long as there is SOME but not OVER 0.006 or 0.007 then you should be okay.

Edited by SE Kansas 46 CJ-2A - 25 Feb. 2024 at 3:50pm
46 CJ-2A #64462 "Ol' Red" (bought April 1969)(second owner)(12 V, 11" brakes, M-38 frame, MD Juan tub)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WellFedHobo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb. 2024 at 4:21pm
That finally clicked when I was working on it today. I pulled the races and axle shafts and pushed them both side to side against the cross shaft. (I was visualizing it incorrectly. I thought they bottomed out inside the spider gear, forgetting the purpose of the cross shaft for a minute since the hole in the gears go straight through.) I can see the "considered one solid piece" now. But after putting the races back on, now I have zero endplay with everything tightened down, reusing the original shims in their original configuration. So there's progress, but too much progress. This could be the Omix cross shaft being out of spec somehow. I wouldn't immediately think it's the axle shafts because they were NOS. But I would think I could tap one or both sides out a little to gain a few thousandths of play by backing the race out? 

Or I just need to pick up more shims because of so many new parts being different than the old parts. 


Edited by WellFedHobo - 25 Feb. 2024 at 4:27pm
Brad
1948 CJ2A #158011 "Sunk Cost Fallacy"
1945 T3-C #1431
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote otto Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb. 2024 at 4:50pm
I'm no drivetrain expert but also struggled with the axle end play as you describe. Half way through page 2 of my build thread details what worked for me:


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WellFedHobo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb. 2024 at 4:59pm
Originally posted by otto otto wrote:

I'm no drivetrain expert but also struggled with the axle end play as you describe. Half way through page 2 of my build thread details what worked for me:

Your solution is exactly what I was hoping for. 
Brad
1948 CJ2A #158011 "Sunk Cost Fallacy"
1945 T3-C #1431
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Beach Bum Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Feb. 2024 at 6:58pm
I have encountered the situation a couple times where when I put it all back together with new bearings, the were not enough shims, not enough end play. I can think of several ways this could come to be but in the end it really doesn’t matter much, it just has to be dealt with. I now keep a couple shim packs on hand “just in case”.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote WellFedHobo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Mar. 2024 at 2:47pm
At long last this thing is 99% done. 



I have to fix the brake line bracket, tear it down a little and mask to do a quick respray, seal the diff cover with Permatex black, swap the brakes from my existing axle, and rob the pinion yoke if it's in good shape. Apparently there's no one out there that sells the correct metal dust shield for a Dana 41 so I'll have to use that one. I'll be doing leaf springs and shocks at the same time so it'll be a fun job to do sometime. Progress sure slowed down for awhile but life happens and priorities shift. 
Brad
1948 CJ2A #158011 "Sunk Cost Fallacy"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dasvis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Mar. 2024 at 3:13pm
Looking good, can't wait to see how it performs.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote win22wrf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Mar. 2024 at 3:13pm
Nice Job!!!
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