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Need help with distributor situation

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote cpt logger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 May 2020 at 2:42am
Bad spark plug wires can cause a "backfire" as you call it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steelyard Blues Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 May 2020 at 4:12am
I recently had a backfire issue suddenly develop. It was strong enough to blow off the oil cup on the air filter three times. Once while I was driving along at 40 MPH. It took me a while to find it in the bushes. I enjoyed having to buy three new quarts of oil to refill it. Anyway, I finally tracked it down to a cheep aluminum conductor distributor cap that I recently purchased. I got a good one with brass contacts and have not had an issue since.
 
Micah
1947 CJ2A 106327, Engine J109205, Tub 97077. Luzon Red

https://www.thecj2apage.com/forums/steelyard-blues_topic41024_post397981.html?KW=micah+movie#397981

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wantcoffee99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2020 at 1:13am
So, not quite out of the woods yet after all.  Jeep won't start again.  I am going to wait to ask for more help from the forum until I get some new spark plug wires on there to rule that out.  I might replace a couple other things too to rule them out.  Some good news though, kind of a neat thing happened to me today.  I decided to go ahead and replace the coil because, well, at $21 for one with a lifetime guarantee might as well.  Anyway, I took the Jeep to the parts store, third time driving it since getting it going again.  On the way home I passed by a 70s Jeepster Commando in a guy's driveway, the guy being outside working on another car.  I asked him if was interested in selling it, to which he promptly said nope.  He then told me he had a whole bunch of '49 CJ2A parts that were left over from a build he did for a friend.  He said I could have them all.  We piled boxes of original parts into my little Jeep, including 5 original rims, a steering column, original carburetor, brake parts, fuel lines, cables, wires, both front fenders, doors (which I won't use, but will find someone who will), and lots of little stuff I have yet to go through.  I talked to him for a bit before heading home.  Told him where I live if ever he needs anything, then drove home.  Upon arriving home I turned off the Jeep so I could unlock my shop, went to start it again and nothing.  I had hoped my coil chose to go out right then, but no such luck as changing it didn't get it to start.  I looked over everything electrical again, even opened up the distributor to check the points gap (just being thorough), but found nothing.  To be sure I was chasing the right gremlin, I gave it some starting fluid with no success.  Like I said, I'll put new wires on it before asking the forum for more help.  I think I'll order a set from Walck's unless someone can recommend something better?  If anyone has suggestions of what else I might change, let me know.  I don't mind putting a little money into it to prevent this kind of problem from happening when I'm not right outside my shop.  I consider myself lucky that it didn't fail to start elsewhere.  I'll post again when I know more.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RICKG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2020 at 1:31am
Originally posted by wantcoffee99 wantcoffee99 wrote:

  We piled boxes of original parts into my little Jeep, including 5 original rims, a steering column, original carburetor, brake parts, fuel lines, cables, wires, both front fenders, doors (which I won't use, but will find someone who will), and lots of little stuff I have yet to go through. 


Dude! Buy a lottery ticket!
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Keep 'em Rollin'
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steelyard Blues Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2020 at 3:58am
I would start with checking the + side of the coil to see if you are getting voltage with the key on. Try the switch a few times to see if you have an intermittent problem with the switch. Are the connections tight? What do you get on the - side? Maybe that new coil in the problem. Try the old one again.
Is the center electrode on the cap making contact with the rotor? Do the edge of the rotor and cap contacts look fried? More of a possible miss issue that starting problem.
 
Spark plug wires do not all fail at once. Generally, the are the source of a miss. So, not sure if you need them unless you were still having a miss when she was running.
 
What do your plugs look like? I don't see you making any mention of them. Another possible source of a miss but should not cause a failure to start unless fouled.
 
Micah
1947 CJ2A 106327, Engine J109205, Tub 97077. Luzon Red

https://www.thecj2apage.com/forums/steelyard-blues_topic41024_post397981.html?KW=micah+movie#397981

1965 Johnson Furnace Company M416 #6-1577
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wantcoffee99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2020 at 5:15am
Originally posted by Steelyard Blues Steelyard Blues wrote:

I would start with checking the + side of the coil to see if you are getting voltage with the key on. Try the switch a few times to see if you have an intermittent problem with the switch. Are the connections tight? What do you get on the - side? Maybe that new coil in the problem. Try the old one again.
Is the center electrode on the cap making contact with the rotor? Do the edge of the rotor and cap contacts look fried? More of a possible miss issue that starting problem.
 
Spark plug wires do not all fail at once. Generally, the are the source of a miss. So, not sure if you need them unless you were still having a miss when she was running.
 
What do your plugs look like? I don't see you making any mention of them. Another possible source of a miss but should not cause a failure to start unless fouled.
 
Micah

Thank you for your input.  I'll check the voltage/for an intermittent problem tomorrow.  Connections should be okay.  I redid the negative coming out of the coil when I was still messing with the points.  The other all looked okay.  I didn't see anything on the cap or rotor, but will take a closer look tomorrow.  I can try the old coil.  As it turns out there was a coil in one of those boxes of free stuff too.  I can try that as well.  There was also a complete set of spark plug wires in much better shape than mine, so I put those on- wouldn't start.  There's a complete distributor in one of the boxes too.  I don't want to pull a distributor unless I'm sure that's my problem though.  I also have no idea if the other is any good.  I looked at the plugs the other day and found that they were barbecue black.  I figured the fuel mixture was too rich.  I cleaned them.  I guess I had better change them to rule that out.  Man it would be sweet if that's the problem.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pplaut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2020 at 4:21pm
If it runs intermittently this is a good thing. At least it runs.
My condenser failed several times. #madeinchina.
It also looks like you are replacing plug wires, and you already replaced the coil.
Fortunately those parts are relatively inexpensive.
~P
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wantcoffee99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2020 at 5:35pm
I put new plugs in it this morning.  Still won't start.  I will recheck some things today.  Beyond that I'm ready to start replacing things until I get it working.  Any suggestions as to what order I should replace things is welcome.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TERRY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2020 at 11:23pm
Replacing parts is one way, doing the necessary diagnostics is better.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pplaut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 May 2020 at 11:27pm
You should try diagnostics first.
Check for spark.
It turns out our distributor is off by 180 degrees. I could have replaced every part and it still would not have started.
It runs now though and eventually we will get the distributor right.
P.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote NCtoy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 May 2020 at 2:04am
I’ll second whoever said to check the switch. I’ve had them go bad before, one time the switch had to be in just the right spot to make the contact to run. You’d be driving and the key would wiggle a little and kill the Jeep. Another time I had one that would not give ignition while starting. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wantcoffee99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 May 2020 at 3:44am
What are the freaking odds that the ignition switch would go out at the exact same time I was changing the points and condenser (leaving me to think it was something I did)?!  I cannot believe it.  I'm all smiles right now though.  To those who suggested checking it I thank you.  In one of those boxes of parts I was given yesterday I found the switch pictured.  I probably just could have crossed the wires, but it didn't occur to me in the moment because I'm not a car thief LOL.  Man it would be easy to steal one of these.  I won't use the other old switch; better to buy a new one.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce W Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 May 2020 at 4:18am
  "I won't use the other old switch; better to buy a new one."

Well, now, I wouldn't be too sure of that.....
BW

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wantcoffee99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 May 2020 at 4:41am
Originally posted by Bruce W Bruce W wrote:

  "I won't use the other old switch; better to buy a new one."

Well, now, I wouldn't be too sure of that.....
BW


New ones not any good?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steelyard Blues Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 May 2020 at 5:04am
Glad you found it. Hopefully with this, and all the other things you have done, your problems are solved. Your backfiring/missing may have been caused by this switch making intermittent contact.
 
I see by the hole in the floor, you don't have the foot starter. I like them because they are period correct. Also, it is a theft deterrent. When my Jeep was dropped of, it took me half an hour to figure out how to start it. Most people don't have a clue about them.
 
I recently replaced my original keyed coil because I was afraid of the same issue you were having. I had purchase an Omix switch a while back and finally put it in. I'm not a fan of it since it does not fit the hole correctly and it has a start position, which I don't use.
 
I purchase a switch similar to this one. I have not gotten around to installing it yet.
 
Your floor switch should be similar to this one:
 
Now, get out and drive it.
 
Micah
1947 CJ2A 106327, Engine J109205, Tub 97077. Luzon Red

https://www.thecj2apage.com/forums/steelyard-blues_topic41024_post397981.html?KW=micah+movie#397981

1965 Johnson Furnace Company M416 #6-1577
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce W Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 May 2020 at 6:11am
Originally posted by wantcoffee99 wantcoffee99 wrote:

Originally posted by Bruce W Bruce W wrote:

  "I won't use the other old switch; better to buy a new one."

Well, now, I wouldn't be too sure of that.....
BW


New ones not any good?

  We're constantly hearing about new parts that don't fit, new parts that don't work, new parts that don't last, new parts that are vastly inferior to the originals. As Pop would say, "They don't make them like they used to!"
BW
It is NOT a Jeep Willys! It is a Willys jeep.

Happy Trails! Good-bye, Good Luck, and May the Good Lord Take a Likin' to You!

We Have Miles to Jeep, Before We Sleep.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TERRY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 May 2020 at 3:06pm
Originally posted by wantcoffee99 wantcoffee99 wrote:

What are the freaking odds that the ignition switch would go out at the exact same time I was changing the points and condenser (leaving me to think it was something I did)?!  I cannot believe it.  I'm all smiles right now though.  To those who suggested checking it I thank you.  In one of those boxes of parts I was given yesterday I found the switch pictured.  I probably just could have crossed the wires, but it didn't occur to me in the moment because I'm not a car thief LOL.  Man it would be easy to steal one of these.  I won't use the other old switch; better to buy a new one.


Have you checked the switch with a meter to be sure it was the problem? And if it was, it is possible to gently open the retaining clips, open it (watch for springs and small parts), clean the contacts and have it working again.
The beauty of the keyed coil is that it is impossible to hot wire without significant surgery.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wantcoffee99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 May 2020 at 10:49pm
I was able to find a 2 position switch at a local battery/auto electrics store.  I installed it, and it fired right up.  I turned it off and back on several times before taking it for a drive.  I didn't go far, and didn't turn the Jeep off until I got home.  It started back up, though it struggled a bit to do so.  I took it back out for another short drive and back.  This time it would not start up again.  So, I guess the switch wasn't the issue.  In and of itself, it's no big deal that I changed the switch- the old one was feeling loose anyway.  The next thing in that direction was the push button.  I took it off and redid the wire ends as one had started to break off/was hanging on by a few strands of wire.  This did not help.  I tried starting it without the button, touching the wires together.  It tried to start, sounded no different than when I tried with the button, and did not start.  I followed one of the wires from the push button to the starter solenoid.  At least, that's what I think it is- mounted on the firewall behind the air filter.  I had redone that wire end previously when working under the hood.  What are the signs of a solenoid that is going out?  It seems significant to me that both of the previous two times that I went out for a drive it failed to start after driving it for a bit.  The first time, when I went to the auto parts store I only had to drive it a couple blocks.  Then I drove a few block out of my way, turned it off outside the house of the awesome guy who gave me a bunch of parts for it.  Started it back up and drove a few blocks home.  That's when it wouldn't start.  Today's experience was similar- drove it a little, turned it off, it started, drove some more, turned it off and it would not start again.  Does that sound like the behavior of something that is going out?  Like it warms up and then won't function?  It seems like as far as wire connections go that I've checked them all.  It still backfires.  At the same time it seems to run a bit smoother than it did before I changed the points and condenser.  I'm thinking the backfire/sputter may be due to the carburetor needing adjustment.  I don't want to touch the carb until I get the issue with it not starting sorted out.  I'm back to the drawing board, and additional input would be very welcome.  Thank you all for reading this and for any advice you have to give.
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