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134-F head card rebuild question?

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    Posted: 08 May 2021 at 9:10am
I'm rebuilding my Solex carb on my CJ and I have some leftover parts I can't find a home for.

1. The big bolt on the left looks EXTREMELY out of place and I can't see how that thing can go
anywhere on this tiny carb, but I assume the biggest round, orange, gasket just to it's right goes with it as it fits perfectly, maybe a mistake?
2. The other two orange, paper, round gaskets I assume are spares maybe, and if so, I can see the reason for them.
3. The two round, black, rubber gaskets are a mystery to me as I didn't see any rubber gaskets anywhere in the take down.
4. But the biggest question is where does the brass pipe with holes go?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scratch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2021 at 9:15am
This is what's supposed to be in the kit.  I don't see the large bolt and gasket, or the two rubber gaskets so maybe those are mistakes, but I do see the brass pipe?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scratch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2021 at 9:42am
I can't find the correct names but I can see the tube is number 17 on this drawing.  it looks like it's inside number 16.  I can unscrew and replace number 22, and I think I can see the old number 17 inside part number 16, but I can't figure out how to get it out of there?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steelyard Blues Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2021 at 11:22am
Scratch,
It is the emulsion tube. Something that should have come out when you were cleaning the carb as there are passages leading to it. 

It is not difficult to remove. Just unscrew the jet and use a dental pick or something similar to pull it out. 

Here are some better diagrams:

Micah
1947 CJ2A, Body & Frame: 106327, Engine: J109205, Tub and Tailgate: 97077. Originally Luzon Red

1965 Johnson Furnace Company M416 #6-1577
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scratch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2021 at 2:51pm
I managed to get it out with a few different dental picks.  Thanks Micah.
but now I see the original one on the bottom is much different.  The old one is longer, has less holes and the biggest problem is that the new one has a higher "shoulder" so it won't drop down all the way and allow the jet to be screwed in.  I guess I'll just use the old one.  It wasn't very dirty either.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scratch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2021 at 2:56pm
Also I noticed that the new jet says 190 and the old jet says 160.  
Is this going to be a problem?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IronAge52 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2021 at 6:33pm
I just help t out my B in law with his newly acquired 3a.
that big bolt on the left is  used with another fitting that feeds gas to the carburetor.
it routs gas at a 90 degree angle to the carb.
I think its called a banjo fitting.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steelyard Blues Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2021 at 7:32pm
Scratch,
Go to the page I referenced previously and look at the .pdf for the F head. 

You are looking at the air correction jet. More air and it runs leaner above idle. The 160 is the standard and 190 is the economy. If you are not at high altitude, I would stay with the 160. 

As for the emulsion tube, I have no idea why you have a different one. I would stick with the original one.

Micah
1947 CJ2A, Body & Frame: 106327, Engine: J109205, Tub and Tailgate: 97077. Originally Luzon Red

1965 Johnson Furnace Company M416 #6-1577
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce W Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2021 at 8:28pm
  Don’t tell me, let me guess - Omix-ADA?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Oldpappy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 May 2021 at 9:12pm
The kit I got off Ebay for my YF was really just a refresh kit, not a true rebuild kit, had gaskets, an incorrect float valve, a questionable looking accelerator pump, and not much else. I have no idea where it came from, I just know where it went.

The second kit I ordered from QTM. It was a master rebuild kit with all the parts needed, and all parts looked correct. The diaphragm of the accelerator pump is modern material that will stand up to the Ethanol gasoline, though I only use 100% gas in my old equipment. With this kit installed the valve holds against pressure from my hand pump very well, and it works fine on the engine.




Edited by Oldpappy - 08 May 2021 at 9:14pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scratch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 May 2021 at 12:51pm
Ok, I'm still having carb problems and am looking for help.  Before I rebuilt this carb, I could get and keep the engine running by pouring gas or starting fluid into the carb easily.  Now that I've done the rebuild, I can get it to fire with a little gas right away, then it seems to flood and I have to wait until the gas evaporates to get it to fire once again, but it'll only fire once.

I'm not sure how I screwed up the carb rebuild.  I kept track of how many turns the three things that needed keeping track of and matched that.  I also am using the original jet, needle and emulsion tube.  None of the original gaskets were tore, although I replaced them all, and the carb wasn't that dirty in the first place.  In fact I had this engine running and driving about a year ago.  The only reason I did a carb kit was that gas wasn't visibly squirting into the carb when I would hit the throttle.

I loosened the incoming gas line to the carb, and when I crank the engine, fuel squirts out as it's supposed to, so I know gas is getting to the carb.

Is there a way to "bench test" or diagnose a carb problem?  
Any ideas?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 May 2021 at 1:07pm
We likely need to know the carburetor model and it’s specific designation.
Is this a 938 and what specific designation is it ? SA, SC or SD ?
We have no idea what specific components have been installed nor do we have reference to those calibrations.
That may well be an issue ? Unknown as of yet.
But primarily you should operate the carburetor as best you can.
Shut off the engine and remove the air horn assembly (cover) from the body.
The depth of fuel measured in the fuel well should be at a depth near 1-1/4”.
If not please indicate the fuel depth observed.

Edit: oh it looks like maybe this is a solex,
In that case I can’t help.


Edited by oldtime - 10 May 2021 at 1:15pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steelyard Blues Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 May 2021 at 8:31pm
Scratch,
If you go to the .pdf I referenced, it recommends a fuel pump pressure of 1 3/4 to 2 pounds. I believe the stock pump is running at 3-5 pounds. 

A lot of people say the carb will not run or flood at the higher pressure. I ran mine for a three years without one and only recently added one. I didn't see any difference. Maybe your carb is a bit more sensitive. 

Also, look at your float. Are you using a new one from the kit or the original? Compare their weights and make sure one is not heavier or taking on fuel. Check the needle and seat assembly. Compare new and original.

Micah


1947 CJ2A, Body & Frame: 106327, Engine: J109205, Tub and Tailgate: 97077. Originally Luzon Red

1965 Johnson Furnace Company M416 #6-1577
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scratch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 May 2021 at 2:31pm
So I pulled the top off the carb again and while it looks like gas is getting "to" the carb, I don't think it's going "in" the carb as the bowl was empty.  I can blow into the fuel inlet and it flows freely through the needle valve until I push the needle which closes the valve.  I'm not sure why it's not going into the bowl.

I compared the old and new needle valve and they both pass the "blow test" but the old one (on bottom) has a larger hole.  I'm not sure why this kit has so many different parts, but I'm going to try the old needle valve next.

If I fill the bowl with gas, then close it all up again, I can get it to fire again regularly... it still wont idle, but at least it'll fire regularly.  I don't have a scale, but the floats seem about the same, ( the old one says 12.5 grams, the new one has no markings) and I don't see any reason it would be getting stuck in the up position which would close the needle valve. 
Any other ideas?

I'm very close to just buying a new replacement carb, but at least I'm learning  some thing about carbs, and I really want to know more about them, so I really want to figure this out as a personal challenge or something.  Maybe I'm just a glutton for punishment...


Edited by Scratch - 13 May 2021 at 2:40pm
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'44 GPW 230283 OD Green
'46 CJ2A 77632 White
'47 CJ2A 141681 Green
'48 CJ2A 156240 Red/Yellow
'48 CJ2A 181341 Red
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scratch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 May 2021 at 2:34pm
Originally posted by Steelyard Blues Steelyard Blues wrote:

Scratch,
If you go to the .pdf I referenced, it recommends a fuel pump pressure of 1 3/4 to 2 pounds. I believe the stock pump is running at 3-5 pounds. 

A lot of people say the carb will not run or flood at the higher pressure. I ran mine for a three years without one and only recently added one. I didn't see any difference. Maybe your carb is a bit more sensitive. 

Also, look at your float. Are you using a new one from the kit or the original? Compare their weights and make sure one is not heavier or taking on fuel. Check the needle and seat assembly. Compare new and original.

Micah


I'm not sure how to measure the fuel pressure as I don't have a pressure gauge.
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'47 CJ2A 141681 Green
'48 CJ2A 156240 Red/Yellow
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'61 CJ5 123120 Tan
'76 CJ7 Camo
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scratch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 May 2021 at 4:01pm
Update: I wanted to see if fuel would get pumped into the bowl without the float, so I actually removed the float and put it back together. It was definitely pumping fuel into the bowl so I'm not sure if I have an issue with the float or something like that but I have tried the new and old float as well as the new and old float toggle and spindle.
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'44 GPW 230283 OD Green
'46 CJ2A 77632 White
'47 CJ2A 141681 Green
'48 CJ2A 156240 Red/Yellow
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'61 CJ5 123120 Tan
'76 CJ7 Camo
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scratch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 May 2021 at 4:54pm
Double post Embarrassed

Edited by Scratch - 13 May 2021 at 5:51pm
'43 GPW 93487 Black
'44 GPW 230283 OD Green
'46 CJ2A 77632 White
'47 CJ2A 141681 Green
'48 CJ2A 156240 Red/Yellow
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'61 CJ5 123120 Tan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steelyard Blues Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 May 2021 at 10:57pm
If you have a vacuum gauge, they often do double duty as a fuel pressure gauge. 

Under the brass plug near the fuel inlet is a mesh screen or at least there should be. Have you cleaned that out?

Micah
1947 CJ2A, Body & Frame: 106327, Engine: J109205, Tub and Tailgate: 97077. Originally Luzon Red

1965 Johnson Furnace Company M416 #6-1577
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