A little project update on Chug A Lug |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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So a few of you might wonder why no up dates. Well yesterday would be a good example. We hauled two loads of gravel to a forest service road. 400+ miles for the two trips sucked every drop of fuel out of my 125 gallon tank and took 11.5 hours with pre trip and post trip truck inspections. This took place back and forth up over the Cascade Mountains. Some beautiful country. But I barely made it trough dinner before passing out asleep in my chair in the living room. Luckily I get to get up at 4:15 am today and do it again. Not a lot of time to work on CHUG I am afraid.
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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Well of course its pissing down rain since I have a full weekend off (maybe even Monday) So yesterday I did some jet swapping and found a little more power and closer Air Fuel Ratio numbers. We went on a very scenic drive to a small country inn about 14 miles from home I chose a bunch of gravel roads with some steep hills to see how CHUG was running with the new jets. Did very well. So today I decided to go completely through the tuning steps on the Weber. I found the float was not anywhere near where it should be, fixed that. I dropped down to the next size small Main Jets and dropped a couple sizes on the Air Correction Jets (based on a talk with 52 M38 and his experience with the Weber DGV) I took one very wet test drive and came back to do some fiddling around with the adjustment screws but no Jet changes. It shows its running a big Lean at Idle right now. I want to run it for a while again before I change anything. If it rains tomorrow (Monday) they are talking about calling off work so I might be able to in between showers get in a couple test runs. Going to fix the Air Compressor electrical supply line problem I developed while down at Mikes at the Spring Fling. Should just be a matter of making up a new 1" #12 wire with a couple terminal lugs on it. That was where the juice stopped when I tested it on the trail. I got the leading edge of the Top riveted together Sat morning. But I can't do anything with it cause I would need to reassemble the top on the tub to take the next steps and that would anchor CHUG in place until I take it back off and its a 2 man job. OH and I learned a valuable lesson at dinner the other night. DO NOT LEAVE TO GO OUT TO TALK TO THE GUYS LOOKING AT YOUR JEEP DURING DINNER. She was not amused LOL. Had to buy her a second glass of wine just to make her smile. And since I was reminded of my mistake as we entered the house at the end of the evening I guess I best take note. |
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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OK now I am completely frustrated. I have a real nice idle tune on and I am seeing around 14.4-1 on the Air/Fuel ratio gauge. When out on the Hwy at 55-60mph I am seeing around 12.1-3-1 so showing rich. Yet when I do a 55mph 4 mile blast shut the engine off at RPM and coast to a stop then pull #2 plug to see what color the ceramic is its BONE WHITE as if I am running Lean! SO I hate to say this but I give up. I just made an appointment with a guy in Salem who comes highly recommended by the British Sports car guys around here as being the person to have a Weber DGV tuned by. He will do this on his Dyno. Its not going to be cheap but if it gains me a single MPG over what I am getting or 5HP more then I am seeing its well worth it. So July 6th I take my CHUG to the Carb guy and hope it all works out. I'll drive it to work and then drop it off afterwards (hopefully I won't get screwed by work) And Audrey can come pick me up. Then when its ready I can probably get someone at work to run me over to the guys shop to pick it up. Or the wife can come in and pick me up. I was hoping I could get the carb dialed in like I did on the wifes 67 Mustang but this is just a little bit picker. |
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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OK the Dyno tune is scheduled and so is my first real car show of the year (who knows maybe my only car show of the year) It will be on the 4th hoping the 15 year old grand daughter can go with (gotta ask DAD) Its about 55 miles away so that should be about right. She's only ever been around town here. |
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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Wife and I went down town to check out the goodies at the new little food truck court. And later I decided to run up to Scotts Mills a tiny town about 8 miles away from Silverton and then to run up Butte Creek Canyon for a while. The wife had not brought a Jacket so when she started getting chilly we high tailed it for home. The thing to report here is that I changed the way the Bikini top back straps are attached to the jeep and made some little Micarta clips that slip up under the back lip of the tub and then have a cross pin to pull the straps through allowing me to tighten then much like a belt but with a lot of leverage. The results were very pleasing the top doesn't flap near as much I was afraid that once up to speed the fabric would loosen but we did about 7 miles at 60mph on the way home (the mrs. need the bathroom!) and its still nice and snug. I also got my little onboard cooler finished it sits right behind the center console. The grand daughter and I will test it out tomorrow when we do a car show about 45 miles from home. With 1" Pink foam insulation its way better insulted then the small coolers you buy in a store. |
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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Photos for previous post Me and the Mrs. (Ok so selfies are really not my thing) And the little lunch cooler Its made from composite sign board (2 layers of .020" aluminum with about a .090 layer of composite) and some .062 x 3/4" aluminum angle and a zillon pop rivets. The hinge is Stainless from my junk pile so of course the paint barely sticks to it. The insulation is 1" thick Owens Corning Pink foam board R5 same as I am using for the hard top. No drain going to try to keep the Ice contained. it gives me a nice place to store the Seatbelt cushion I use to cushion the hood when I open it to help keep down rub marks. Thats the fuzzy black thing. And once I have the wood strips on the floor I will make a more secure way to anchor it against the console. Edited by Mark W. - 03 July 2022 at 2:13pm |
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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OK last night afterwork I dropped CHUG off at a mechanics shop in Salem who is reputed to be the Weber guru. He will tune the carb while on his chassis dyno to make sure he squeezes the best he can out of it. I really liked the guy I also liked the 69 CJ-5 and the 42 Dodge ambulance that belong to the shop (the shops owner this mechanics dad had just recently passed away) I saw all the right kind of cars being worked on a MG Midget or could have been a Bug eye Sprite (only seen from the rear) a MGB a 66 Mustang a pre 55 Ford sedan out front where the mechanics park their cars while at work was a 65 F-100 So CHUG felt right at home. We had about a half hour long talk about how CHUG was built and what he needed to know to do a good job for me. CHUG was moved right inside to sit on the Chassis Dyno until finished and I pick it up. They completely understood CHUG does not sit outside even behind a 16' fence! It was weird near as I can tell except for when we weren't home this is the first time since early spring 2004 I haven't slept within 20 ft of CHUG LOL (oh I guess you have to count Mikes Spring Fling but then CHUG was safe with Mike and the other Jeep guys at Mikes when I was 30 miles away at the Motel. The mechanic will be doing a final Dyno pull to 4200rpm to plot the Torque and HP curves and I will know what all my work has resulted in. Fingers crossed. I should know by Saturday at the latest.
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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dasvis
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 07 Sep. 2019 Location: Salem, Oregon Status: Offline Points: 1550 |
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Having Rory take a look at it eh? Good call.
Dan J & I put my 1993 22RE Toyota 4x4 on that dyno back in the day. 110hp!, proudly the lowest hp vehicle he had on the dyno to that point.
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1947 CJ2A #88659 "Rat Patrol"
1953 CJ3A #453-GB1 11266 "Black Beauty" 1964 Thunderbird convertible ..... & one of them moves under it's own power!! |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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OK something a lot of people have wanted to know for a long time. WHAT DOES MARK's 134L make for HP and Torque. Well the simple answer is 46.23HP at 3650rpm and 80.91ftlbs at 2410rpm AT THE DRAWBAR since this really only relates to another dyno test done on this dyno under the same conditions its very hard to compare it to say the old school engine dyno test the factory did. Or even others that have been done resently on other chassis dynos. The engine was run up to 4500rpm in the tests I have looked at just about every 134L or F dyno test I can find on the Net and they all seam very different. A note the Mech/Tuner ONLY worked on my carb he did not adjust even timing so its very possible now that the carb is running as it should that I can find some more HP with a better tune. I will tell you that CHUG is running very snappy and accelerates to 60 mph very well. Later today I plan on doing a timed 0-60mph run just to see what I can get. So there you have the results of the first Dyno test on my engine.
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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OK I downloaded an app called Drag Racer from the Google Play Store free with some ads. I went out on the arrow straight and almost level Hwy 214 just north of my house and made a first run at 0-60mph Chug was just barely warmed up the air temp was about 60-61 degrees F no wind. results with 100% GPS accuracy 10mph 0.9sec @ 9ft 20mph 4.1sec @89ft 30mph 7.6sec @223ft 40mph 12.5sec @480ft 50mph 19.4sec @937ft 60mph 42.0sec @2753ft 1/8th mile = 15.4sec @44mph 1/4 mile = 24.5sec @52mph So those are my base lines to tune against. A fun comparison the 1968 Wagoneer with the 6cyl 3spd did 0-60 in 14.2sec and the 1/4 mile in 19.9sec at 68 mph So if anyone wants a way to compare their Willys to CHUG this would be a way.
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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Interesting if I plug my numbers from this mornings run into one of the ET/HP calculators I end up showing it takes approx 52HP to throw a 3100lb vehicle down a 1/4 mile track in 24.5 sec and hit a trap speed of 52mph. Though depending on which calculator a person uses they show everywhere from 36 to 52HP being able to do that.
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Bill2A
Member Joined: 01 Mar. 2018 Location: Fort Worth, Tex Status: Offline Points: 517 |
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So, with enough high tech help you can get a number that is almost as good as a wild guess?
3,100 seems heavy for a flat fender. Did you weigh it?
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1946 CJ2A 14098
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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yes I weighed it CHUG has a lot more to it then a stock 2A. And I weigh 250lb
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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So as I have no time to work on CHUG or the hard top project due to 55hr plus weeks at work I thought I would start buying up materials for finishing the hard top so today I ordered a sheet of 6061 1/8" x 24 x 48 Aluminum that will become the bottom half of the doors. Found some open box grade stuff on eBay for $97 with shipping so that's on its way. Pretty close to the last thing I will need until I order locally the 1/4" scratch resistant Polycarbonate for the windows. We have a TAP Plastic's place about 40 min North of here that carries it in stock. So I will once the metal of the top is done make some patterns and have them cut it for me. Lot less stress that way. it might not break like glass but it can still be cut the wrong size or scratched so let them worry about that. If I do get a chance to work on CHUG #1 on the list is to finally figure out the OD not wanting to stay in direct. That should make a huge difference in driving it. #2 is to work on timing and the timing curve to try to squeeze the horses. I'll also be putting on the big Fresh Air Intake system. That should make a little difference on the hwy. |
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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Some comments on my Dyno run while I can't compare directly to the Original Factory dyno test as to Max HP and Max Torque numbers I can how ever see how the curves compare. On the Factory graph Torque Max is at 2000rpm with 105 ftlbs Max At 1300rpm and 2700rpm its 100ftlbs On my graph Torque Max is at 2410rpm with 80.91ftlbs Max. At 1750rpm and 2700rpm its approx. 80ftlbs at 3000rpm it has only dropped to 78ftlbs which means the curve is much flatter and at a higher rpm so more suited to road speeds. As in OD I run 2655rpm at 60mph or 2435rpm at 55mph So I am within a few RPM of MAX Torque at 55mph which should translate into best Mileage possible. On the HP side of things Factory shows Max HP 60Bhp flat at 3600 to 4000rpm. While my dyno run shows max HP of 46.23HP (chassis dyno) at 3650rpm with the curve showing approx. 44HP at 3000 and 4000rpm and a drop to 40HP at 4350 and 2600rpm The factory curve shows a 9HP drop to 51HP at 2600rpm from the Max So again a flatter curve that gives me approx. 87% of my Max HP at 60mph Now to fine tune the timing and a few other things and see if I can do even better now that the carb is pretty much tuned. I according to the Dyno and my Air Fuel Gauge its still a little on the rich side. But now I know what jets to go to to fix that.
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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67charger
Member Joined: 27 Sep. 2011 Location: Kentucky Status: Offline Points: 1272 |
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You might have already said this but the Willys dynos are probably flywheel hp and torque. In the 70s they changed to the rear wheel hp an torque and the numbers were less. All those 400 hp muscles cars turned into 350 hp etc.
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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I have been told by some old school engine guys that when a engine was tested back in the day. The dyno was attached to the flywheel and there were no engine mounted accessories like a generator or even a fan belt (coolant was pumped through the block during the test) Another Chassis dyno test done to test the difference between a stock head and a Kaiser Supersonic head. This resulted in a test showing 40HP at 4000rpm stock head. 48HP with the Kaiser head. |
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Steelyard Blues
Member Joined: 09 Oct. 2017 Location: Reno, NV Status: Offline Points: 1500 |
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Mark,
Not sure if you had seen this. I stumbled across it a while back when searching for an aluminum head. Maybe it gives you something to compare. A little history on HP measurements. Micah |
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1947 CJ2A 106327, Engine J109205, Tub 97077. Luzon Red
https://www.thecj2apage.com/forums/steelyard-blues_topic41024_post397981.html?KW=micah+movie#397981 1965 Johnson Furnace Company M416 #6-1577 |
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