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Pope's 1949 CJ3A - 4.3L, SM465, Dana 18 Swap

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    Posted: 05 Dec. 2023 at 1:31pm
I have seen the Ford boxes mounted behind the axle but just didn't look like the best idea to me. 

I am in the process of mounting a Saginaw box on a CJ2A frame. This is my first time for doing a Saginaw conversion, but a friend of mine with far more experience with this, and who is a far better welder than I am, fabricated the mount, boxed the frame horns, and tunneled the crossmember for the shaft. 

This Jeep will have a two hole knuckle and one piece tie rod. He mounted the box as far forward on the frame horn as possible so that the drag link would have plenty of clearance with the tie rod.

The frame is 50 miles away at a friend's shop so I can't take a picture right now, but you seem to have a good grasp of the idea.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec. 2023 at 12:59pm
I decided to create a mounting plate for the steering box, then weld it to the frame rails.  It should be plenty strong.

To create a mounting plate, first I made a paper template by tracing the holes in the steering box.  Then, I transferred those holes with a punch to some scrap sheet metal.  After confirming the fit, I transferred those holes to some 3/8" thick plate.  Super simple stuff.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec. 2023 at 12:53pm
After some more tinkering, thinking, and procrastinating I decided the Ford steering box had to go.  It would be interfering too much with the suspension travel.  

Note: For those of you considering a Dana 30 front axle swap, put your steering box in front of the grill, not behind it like I did.  I also updated my previous posts from a few years ago to help "steer" people away from using the Ford reverse rotation box.

When I originally built this jeep, I welded the box in such a way to make the removal easy if I ever changed my mind.  Well, here I am.  After 90 minutes, it was out.  The new box should be installed soon.





Edited by Pope891 - 05 Dec. 2023 at 1:00pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec. 2023 at 12:45pm
Now time to trim the fenders.  The rear axle was moved back about 2.25".  I also added 1.25" wheel spacers from Spidertrax.  I'd prefer not to add wheel spacers, but it's cheaper than modifying the existing axle and ordering new shafts...maybe someday.





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov. 2023 at 9:23am
I decided to make some high clearance spring plates.  A few well-known vendors sell these things, albeit a much prettier version(s).  I decided to try my hand at making a set from 3" tube and 1.25" angle.  All 3/16" thick steel.  After some thinking, I came up with a design that would require multiple welds to fail before anything "let go".  I'm no mechanical engineer, but I think these will hold up nicely.








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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Oldpappy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Nov. 2023 at 2:53pm
I think the fenders will prevent much further movement.Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Nov. 2023 at 2:35pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Nov. 2023 at 2:33pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Nov. 2023 at 2:31pm

Before I started welding everything together, I wanted to conduct a quick and dirty mockup to make sure my new Dana 30 wouldn't hit my steering shaft under full compression.

I tacked the spring hanger in place threw on a few U bolts to see what would happen.  Putting weight on the spring was a little sketchy but I think I confirmed that the steering shaft will not come in contact with my axle tube unless the spring starts to invert.  Keep in mind, this is a rough mockup.  If I find this interference is a problem when I driving around, I'll just have to move the steering box in front of the grill.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct. 2023 at 12:53pm
The rear axle needs to be moved about 2" to the rear.  Here is the stock location:





And about 2" to the rear:


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct. 2023 at 12:48pm
Time to extend the front of the frame.  Like so many flatfenders, the frame horns were patched and welded so many times that you really don't know what is original, square or straight.  

I cut a 2x4" tube down and created an extension.  These are 12" sleeves that fit over the existing frame horns.  The existing frame is 8" long, so these sleeves fit snuggly and extend the frame about 4" in total.  A new front bumper will also be added later.





Edited by Pope891 - 14 Nov. 2023 at 9:27am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct. 2023 at 11:00am
I purchased four new rear CJ2A springs from Quadratec at $107 each.  SKU: 56010-01

10 leaves.  Made in India.  We shall see how they work...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote otto Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct. 2023 at 10:31am
Curious which rear spring you’re going with, I’m thinking of doing something similar. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct. 2023 at 9:40am
My steering setup was my biggest concern with this phase of the build.  If the steering box geometry didn't work, I was going to have to tear the entire front of the jeep apart and start from scratch.  I have Herm's style steering setup using a Ford reverse rotation steering box from an early F150.  It's cool because it fits inside of the grill (barely), but the steering shaft drops directly over the axle tube, depending on where you place it.  This can cause interference issues when the suspension is fully compressed.

In my case, during full stuff I think I'll be ok.  At worst, the axle tube might kiss the shaft in a violent compression.  But to avoid any issues, I think I will cut the last 1/2" of the shaft off once the axle is fully installed. 

Also good news.  The drag link and tie rod are nearly parallel and don't appear to interfere with each other.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Oct. 2023 at 9:30am
The old Dana 27 came out this weekend.  I have a buyer for it already.  


The new Dana 30 and springs are installed to start measuring where my new frame horns need to be.  The previous owner(s) had really mangled the frame horns and I didn't spend much time fixing them earlier in this build.  So this is my opportunity to make them stronger to support the longer 41" rear springs and the Warn 8274 winch. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Oct. 2023 at 9:11am
This purchase was not planned.

As it turns out, someone local had a set of 35" BFG Krawlers for sale.  They were listed as "Jeep Tires".  The poor guy didn't realize what he had!  The knubs are still on them.  I wonder if they have ever seen pavement.

Now this build will take an entirely different direction once the Dana 30 is installed.  This evolved from: 

"Hey, let's install a Dana 30, some new springs and lengthen the wheelbase a touch."

To:

"While I'm here...."




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pope891 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Oct. 2023 at 12:56pm
Originally posted by Craig1017 Craig1017 wrote:

If you want to keep the rear hubs - they are very handy - I put a set of "Stage 8 locking fastners" on mine - it will absolutely stop them from backing out - it's not cheap to do all 4 corners though. 

I agree with you there.  I've researched them and figured that keeping a set of drive flanges on the rear is less expensive and stronger.  I keep one Warn hub for the rears in my tool kit in case something goes wrong on the trails.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AKoller Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Oct. 2023 at 12:47pm
Originally posted by Craig1017 Craig1017 wrote:

If you want to keep the rear hubs - they are very handy - I put a set of "Stage 8 locking fastners" on mine - it will absolutely stop them from backing out - it's not cheap to do all 4 corners though. 


I just looked them up and they have a slick system. Thanks for the suggestion. I can see other places where this could be used.
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