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Pulling camshaft gear to change engine plate? |
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Adventure Van 
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Joined: 12 Aug. 2021 Location: AZ Status: Offline Points: 95 |
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 Topic: Pulling camshaft gear to change engine plate?Posted: 13 Dec. 2021 at 11:32pm |
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...and thank you ALL for helping me to come to my conclusion. I am going to mig tack weld the existing hole closed and drill a new hole on the opposite face, using a #60 bit. Thanks again!
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Lee MN
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Joined: 13 Aug. 2008 Location: Harris, MN Status: Offline Points: 4950 |
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Posted: 13 Dec. 2021 at 11:09pm |
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Your the man 👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽😎 Lee😉 |
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LEE
44 GPW-The Perfected Willys 49 2A “If you wait, you only get older” 67 M715 American Made Rolling History |
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Ron D
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Joined: 27 Oct. 2019 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 1441 |
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Posted: 13 Dec. 2021 at 10:58pm |
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Thanks for making my point.
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1951 M38
1951 M100 |
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Lee MN
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Joined: 13 Aug. 2008 Location: Harris, MN Status: Offline Points: 4950 |
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Posted: 13 Dec. 2021 at 10:51pm |
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Plugging it off seems needless for no apparent reason other than lazy? [/QUOTE] “WOW”, lazy, really…. Short of indexing the oil spray hole in the direction of the gear there is no more effort to install a spray nozzle than a pipe plug 😂. Lee😉 |
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LEE
44 GPW-The Perfected Willys 49 2A “If you wait, you only get older” 67 M715 American Made Rolling History |
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Mark W.
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Posted: 13 Dec. 2021 at 9:53am |
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The Gear oiler is screwed into the end of the Oil galley that supplys all the bearing oil. If the hole in it is .070" it becomes easier for the oil to pass out of the galley there then moving into the #1 bearing. By reducing it to .040" it creates the proper back pressure to insure oil moves to the Bearing. It has nothing to do with the oil filter or the lines from and to the filter. I drilled and tapped mine for a tiny brass plug drilled to .040" with a #60 drill bit.
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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WeeWilly
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Posted: 13 Dec. 2021 at 9:31am |
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I believe the manual was refering to the size of the hole causing a problem with #1 rod and main bearing not getting enough oil with the larger hole. That orfice wasn't used until Willys started using gears instead of chain to drive the cam and it is there for lubricating the gears . There was a hole in the end of the crank and sprocket to oil the chain drive system.
Jim
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47 CJ2A (Ranch Hand) 48 CJ2A, 48 Willys truck, T3C 3782, M274 (Military Mule)
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Ron D
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Joined: 27 Oct. 2019 Location: South Carolina Status: Offline Points: 1441 |
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Posted: 12 Dec. 2021 at 11:16pm |
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Just my 2 cents. Somebody ought to say it. The manual says that .040 oil jet fitting is directly related to proper oil pressure (lubrication) for the #1 connecting rod bearing. The oil filter return line has zero to do with that conrod bearing. The .040 jet squirting the crank and cam gears might seem incidental (or overkill with the oil filter return line), but it seems to me the Willys engineers knew what they were doing by putting it there for the conrod bearing in the first place. And if they discovered it wasn't needed, wouldn't there be a service bulletin saying it was ok to plug? Plugging the hole might be good luck for some folks and run for miles and miles and years and years with no trouble, but I'm not one of them. It's a $10 part, not expensive to have it there, and not hard to find one or re-drill the orifice to .040. Plugging it off seems needless for no apparent reason other than lazy? I bet back in the day when the jeep motor was new if you plugged it you'd void the warranty. And if the oil filter was an option not taken (or somebody removed it) --- and the oil jet hole was also plugged --- what would lubricate the crank and cam gears? Good luck? Perhaps the real reason it's there is just for that case, we'll never know. Until then, I believe it's there for the conrod bearing. It'd be interesting to find out if any professional engine builders experienced with Willys motors would say plugging that hole is ok or is something they'd do. Edited by Ron D - 12 Dec. 2021 at 11:39pm |
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1951 M38
1951 M100 |
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cpt logger
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Posted: 12 Dec. 2021 at 7:20pm |
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I am with Bruce on this. I believe that the Willys engineers thought that since the oil has to get back into the sump, why not put it to use? It may as well lubricate the gears on the way to the sump. The oil filter was an option in the early CJs. On the few I have seen that have no oil filter, there is no line feeding a nozzle to lube the gears. Does it make a difference? I doubt that any of us would notice any. However, if it is possible, all of my rigs get an oil filter, since the filter does make a difference, so I will never know.
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Bruce W
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Posted: 11 Dec. 2021 at 6:20pm |
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Some believe that the purpose of the oil filter draining into the front cover is to lubricate the timing gears. While I don’t agree that it’s the primary reason for the drain being there, it probably would do a good enough job.
BW
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It is NOT a Jeep Willys! It is a Willys jeep.
Happy Trails! Good-bye, Good Luck, and May the Good Lord Take a Likin' to You! We Have Miles to Jeep, Before We Sleep. |
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Lee MN
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Posted: 11 Dec. 2021 at 4:29pm |
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My old engine ran for 30 years with none of the above issues, new motor has ran for 4 years with no issues, the old timer that showed me this trick has done it for decades with no issues, not saying it’s right, but it works 😬 Lee 
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LEE
44 GPW-The Perfected Willys 49 2A “If you wait, you only get older” 67 M715 American Made Rolling History |
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Adventure Van
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Posted: 11 Dec. 2021 at 1:02pm |
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What? Really? Not needed to oil the cam and crank gears? ... but that's not what the TSM says to do?
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Lee MN
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Posted: 11 Dec. 2021 at 12:20pm |
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Screw in an 1/8” pipe plug and forget about it 😎
Lee😉 |
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LEE
44 GPW-The Perfected Willys 49 2A “If you wait, you only get older” 67 M715 American Made Rolling History |
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WeeWilly
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Posted: 11 Dec. 2021 at 10:47am |
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You could tap it for a threaded plug and just drill another hole in it or on the next flat. I would probably use the mig and weld it and redrill it.
Jim
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47 CJ2A (Ranch Hand) 48 CJ2A, 48 Willys truck, T3C 3782, M274 (Military Mule)
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Adventure Van
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Posted: 11 Dec. 2021 at 10:20am |
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Ok, I'm finally ready (3 months later  ) to reinstall the oiler and the time has come to deal with the too large of an oiler orifice issue. My only brazing tools are for copper plumbing. I have MAPP gas, not oxy/acetylene. I also have a mig welder. I'd appreciate advice on the best method to fill in the hole, before I drill the correct size hole. Thanks! Edited by Adventure Van - 11 Dec. 2021 at 10:36am |
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Bruce W
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Posted: 03 Oct. 2021 at 12:49pm |
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“ The other thought is offer BW cookies and a HBR to come and pop the gear off for me-------LOL
 ” Just bring it here, with the coffee and cookies, and I’ll do it!  BW
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It is NOT a Jeep Willys! It is a Willys jeep.
Happy Trails! Good-bye, Good Luck, and May the Good Lord Take a Likin' to You! We Have Miles to Jeep, Before We Sleep. |
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Oilleaker1
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Joined: 06 Sep. 2011 Location: Black Hills, SD Status: Offline Points: 4412 |
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Posted: 02 Oct. 2021 at 7:49am |
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I appreciate this post. I'm going to change from a pickup truck front motor plate to a 2A plate. I felt through the 2 holes and the flat area the inside puller has to engage is not much. Like 1/8 inch of flat. When the engine is together and you pull one of the timing gears off, there is tension due to valve springs etc. I have ruined cam gears myself since the spiral action against the tension can get quite stiff. I plan on re-checking valves and installing a new copper head gasket that I now use instead of fiber. (I hate the felpro steel one sided SOB). I'm pulling all the valves, head, springs, distributor, and installing a new oil pump. I will pull the cam out and bypass all of your pain. I built this engine and it's on the stand still new. I can flip the engine over and let gravity keep the tappets out of the way of the cam lobes. Much easier to do this all while out. I'll also check my valve face pattern with Dykem and lap if necessary. I sure felt pain seeing all your pictures. Good part is you will win this project.
The other thought is offer BW cookies and a HBR to come and pop the gear off for me-------LOL PS----if you were to pull the valve springs and keepers, on a assembled engine, make sure and stuff rags in all the side chest drain holes so the keepers don't fall down into the camshaft or oil pan. ask me how I know this. Oilly
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Green Disease, Jeeps, Old Iron!
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Adventure Van
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Posted: 01 Oct. 2021 at 6:54pm |
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Thanks Ron. I hope to have mine off this weekend.
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Ron D
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Posted: 01 Oct. 2021 at 6:49pm |
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Your replacement front engine plate to swap is packaged and ready to ship.
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1951 M38
1951 M100 |
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Ron D wrote: