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Kinda Cool Piece of History

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    Posted: 02 Dec. 2022 at 6:37pm
So for those who do not know, following WW1 the Veterans Conservation Corps (VCC) was created to help train returning war veterans and help them intergrate back into society by providing them technical training. The VCC was reinvented and opened up to civilians, becoming the Civilian Conservation Corps (CCC) where now it exists to provide rural and underserved communities technical training in all sorts of professions. One of which, was automotive repair. So when the kids (16-24) overhauled a car, they would slap one of these on there. 

This was on a 1940’s flat fender Jeep that was recently purchased. 

Kinda cool piece of nitch history.




Edited by IRQVET - 02 Dec. 2022 at 6:39pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Michaeltru Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec. 2022 at 6:42pm
Very cool
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dasvis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec. 2022 at 8:08pm
Very cool
 Love that kind of stuff
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bight Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Dec. 2022 at 8:59pm
in the late 70's there was also the YCC or Youth Conservation Corps. i participated after my junior year in high school. i really enjoyed it though it really was pretty much a slave labor program. i busted my arse and sweated it totally off in the high humidity, high heat of a sweltering Washington DC summer. 

it still exists. 


Edited by bight - 02 Dec. 2022 at 9:03pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote IRQVET Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Dec. 2022 at 4:31pm
Originally posted by bight bight wrote:

in the late 70's there was also the YCC or Youth Conservation Corps. i participated after my junior year in high school. i really enjoyed it though it really was pretty much a slave labor program. i busted my arse and sweated it totally off in the high humidity, high heat of a sweltering Washington DC summer. 

it still exists. 

YCC is the state version of the VCC/CCC. Can’t comment on the state programs as I have no experience with them. I used to work for federal CCC so I found it kinda nostalgic. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m38mike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Dec. 2022 at 5:09am
I love seeing the CCC rebuild tag.  Thanks for sharing that.  

The US Forest Service in the western states still use the YCC to help with all kinds of outdoor projects, like building trails, making fences, helping with logistic support on wildland fires, and working on wildlife habitat improvement projects.  Most of the kids I've talked with really enjoy the outdoor experience, but there are a few city kids that are scared to be out in the forest by themselves.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 64CJ5 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Dec. 2022 at 9:43am
There is a CCC museum in Hill City, SD.  Not large but interesting.  The CCC had projects all through the Black Hills,  they built with rock and the projects are still standing.      
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote duffer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Dec. 2022 at 12:38pm
Originally posted by m38mike m38mike wrote:

I love seeing the CCC rebuild tag.  Thanks for sharing that.  

The US Forest Service in the western states still use the YCC to help with all kinds of outdoor projects, like building trails, making fences, helping with logistic support on wildland fires, and working on wildlife habitat improvement projects.  Most of the kids I've talked with really enjoy the outdoor experience, but there are a few city kids that are scared to be out in the forest by themselves.  

The YCC remains active here.  They are involved with at least one of the local land trusts building/maintaining trails and helping with other conservation projects.  My wife and i benefited from them for an afternoon a few years back when they helped remove some fencing from the part of the place under a conservation easement.

My late father-in-law spent a couple of years at the Hill City CCC camp.  The Birch Creek CCC camp out of Dillon Montana remains pretty much intact and is worth a visit if you are in the area.


More Birch Creek photos here:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/97954210@N04/albums/72177720301868682
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote WillysWally Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Dec. 2022 at 9:31pm
Good Evening Everyone:

While the Appalachian Mountains of North Central Pennsylvania aren't quite the Rockies, they are as rugged as they come in this part of the country.  Logging and lumbering were, and still are, a huge part of this states rich history.  Up along US Highway 6, near Galeton, PA, the PA Lumberman's Museum is located.  Prior to its renovation 4-5 years ago, one half of that original visitor center was devoted to the CCC camps in Pennsylvania.

Twenty-five miles south of the Lumberman's Museum, our family belongs to a camp on the Hamersley Fork of Kettle Creek, which is a tributary of the West Branch of the Susquehanna River.  About a mile up the Hamersley valley from our camp is the location of CCC Camp S-133.  Unfortunately all that is left of that camp is the still standing chimney from the main building   Across the washed out old road ( Now unofficially a, for real, jeep trail) from the old CCC camp location is a memorial monument, located between several large spruce trees, commemorating the location of the camp.

What I found the most interesting about the camps is that they were actually operated or run by the U.S. Army.  The camps had a dual track organizational structure.  The operation, logistics and the administration of the camp was the Army's while the actual conservation work was done under the supervision of a forester, wildlife or some other natural resources professional.

The men were paid $30 per month, majority of it went to their families.  As I recall the CCC members kept $5 and the balance, $25 was sent back home.

Pennsylvania had the second highest number of CCC camps, 151, surpassed only be California.  The reason for this was the work Gifford Pinchot did during his term as Governor of PA to prepare the state for the eventual establishment of those camps.  Most folks know Pinchot has been credited as the founder of the U.S. Forest Service.  But after his stint with the Federal government he continued his public service at the Commonwealths gubernatorial level.

In the old visitor center they showed examples of camp life, uniforms, menus, bunks, blankets, buildings, building layouts, etc.  Anyone who spent time in the military, post war up to the 70's or so would recognize that the CCC camp members were all but already in the Army.  The camps were operated up until 1942, the U.S.'s practical entry into WWII.  I seem to recall that those camps that were still in operation after Pearl Harbor were literately picked up, lock, stock and barrel, and taken to the nearest induction center.  It is a shame that more young people dont have such an experience today.

Although I am not a real fan of a lot of government programs, the CCC camps did have more than the normal amount of pluses.

Regards,

Walter

  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote cpt logger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec. 2022 at 2:22am
My grandfather on my moms side worked in the CCC in Oregon. They upgraded and built some parks for the USFS. They also did work for the state & county governments.

One park they built was on Hwy 6 between Banks & Tillamook. My family visited that park often as it was close to where we lived. It was still there eight years ago when I went to my mom's funeral. It was terribly overgrown & very rarely visited. The flora had almost erased the trails & a few of the bridges over the creek were dangerous to cross with much of the bridge planking rotted away. When I was there, no one had been to the waterfall in years. I found the trail & the falls, but only because I knew where they were. That was a very sad day for me.

My grandfather did receive $5.00 & grandmother & the kids got $25.00 monthly. He was the camp cook. When WWII came, he was working for the USPS as a mail carrier & substitute postmaster. Thus, he was considered in an essential position & was not allowed to enlist in the army for the war. Two of my uncles & one aunt served our country during WWII. One never came home, he was in Bataan on Dec. 7 1941. The other two did not discuss their service after coming home. My aunt served in the Signal Corps. She was posted on a USAAC field. She retired from the Army in 1978 or so. She died in 2019.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JeepFever Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec. 2022 at 10:18am
Originally posted by IRQVET IRQVET wrote:

. . The VCC was reinvented and opened up to civilians, becoming the Civilian Conservation Corps (CCC) where now it exists to provide rural and underserved communities technical training in all sorts of professions. One of which, was automotive repair. So when the kids (16-24) overhauled a car, they would slap one of these on there. 

This was on a 1940’s flat fender Jeep that was recently purchased. 

Kinda cool piece of nitch history.

Interesting,  I did not realize that the CCC lasted so long,  or that they overhauled vehicles.  

I had a great uncle who used to talk about being in CCC and that he helped build Skyline Drive in VA.   To confirm that I had the story correct,  I researched some history.

From nps.gov:

Guard Walls and Guard Rails

The CCC built many of the stone walls along the Drive, particularly those in the South District and those at overlooks. Beginning in 1983 many of the original walls have been rebuilt by the Federal Highways Administration with cores of concrete, reusing the original stone as a veneer. When built the Skyline Drive had miles of chestnut log guardrails, particularly in areas of open fields and meadows. The guardrails rotted and all were removed in the 1950s, not to be replaced.

Civilian Conservation Corps

The CCC "boys" did not construct the roadbed of the Drive as has at times been suggested. But there would be no Skyline Drive without the efforts of the CCC. They graded the slopes on either side of the roadway, built the guardrails and guard walls, constructed overlooks, planted hundreds of thousands of trees and shrubs and acres of grass to landscape both sides of the roadbed, built the picnic areas and campgrounds, comfort stations, visitor contact and maintenance buildings, and made the signs that guided visitors on their way. Many served as the first park interpreters.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote otto Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec. 2022 at 11:26am
Originally posted by cpt logger cpt logger wrote:

My grandfather on my moms side worked in the CCC in Oregon. They upgraded and built some parks for the USFS. They also did work for the state & county governments.

One park they built was on Hwy 6 between Banks & Tillamook. My family visited that park often as it was close to where we lived. It was still there eight years ago when I went to my mom's funeral. It was terribly overgrown & very rarely visited. The flora had almost erased the trails & a few of the bridges over the creek were dangerous to cross with much of the bridge planking rotted away. When I was there, no one had been to the waterfall in years. I found the trail & the falls, but only because I knew where they were. That was a very sad day for me.

My grandfather did receive $5.00 & grandmother & the kids got $25.00 monthly. He was the camp cook. When WWII came, he was working for the USPS as a mail carrier & substitute postmaster. Thus, he was considered in an essential position & was not allowed to enlist in the army for the war. Two of my uncles & one aunt served our country during WWII. One never came home, he was in Bataan on Dec. 7 1941. The other two did not discuss their service after coming home. My aunt served in the Signal Corps. She was posted on a USAAC field. She retired from the Army in 1978 or so. She died in 2019.

Cpt Loggr, 

Does the park you describe along Hwy 6 have a name? I travel 6 frequently to reach the Tillamook forest. I’m curious if I may have been driving past this park all these years. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cpt logger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec. 2022 at 7:32pm
You have been driving by it. I do not recall the name, we just called it grandpa's park. There is no parking area for it anymore. Where the driveway to it was there is now a guardrail. I had to park about 1/8th of a mile uphill from it when I last visited. I do not recall the mile marker either. It is on the coastal slope of the hills there on the southern side of the road.

You know how fast the vegetation grows on the coast range. Imagine thirty years of neglect. That is about right. The stone work was in fairly good shape for being built in the 30s.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote otto Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Dec. 2022 at 10:00pm
Originally posted by cpt logger cpt logger wrote:

You have been driving by it. I do not recall the name, we just called it grandpa's park. There is no parking area for it anymore. Where the driveway to it was there is now a guardrail. I had to park about 1/8th of a mile uphill from it when I last visited. I do not recall the mile marker either. It is on the coastal slope of the hills there on the southern side of the road.

You know how fast the vegetation grows on the coast range. Imagine thirty years of neglect. That is about right. The stone work was in fairly good shape for being built in the 30s.


Thanks for the hint, now I've got a treasure hunt on my hands!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote IRQVET Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec. 2022 at 2:05pm
Yeah I used to work at the Wolf Creek Job Corps in Oregon. It was cool watching those kids come in unmotivated, and a bit ferrel. Then by the time they graduated they were confident and respectful. Its a very underrated program. 

I know this one had a joint mechanics Associate Degree program with the local community college. It was sponsored by Toyota, so the kids got out of there with a AA Degree and a direct path to become a Toyota Certified Mechanic. The kids always had a job lined up prior to graduating at a Toyota Dealership of their choice. And they graduate completely debt free. They did away with the program a few years back, which was unfortunate cause it was the best program they had. 

Now the kids get to choose from:

Welding
Carpentry (Union Pre-Apprenticeship)
Construction Craft Laborer
Culinary Arts
Cement Masonry (Union Pre-Apprenticeship)


Edited by IRQVET - 31 Dec. 2022 at 2:18pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SE Kansas 46 CJ-2A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Dec. 2022 at 8:04pm
We are going to have a real shortage of trades help in the near future. Many of the older trades are getting ready to retire. Welders, electricians, plumbers and carpenters are all going to be in short supply within 5 to 10 years and the educational system is NOT interested in training anyone.

All of the post-secondary educational push is to get kids into college whether they want to or even belong there. Jobs in computers and IT can and will be exported to the next "high-tech" third world country that will pay lower wages than the United States.

Trades jobs are hard to "export". If a kid finds a place that will train them post-secondary then they can graduate in a couple of years pretty much debt free and have a job waiting for them. Unfortunately community colleges are still stuck with the idea that they are a prep school for four (five or even six) year schools. Our current student loan program encourages that.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote IRQVET Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jan. 2023 at 4:30pm
Hence why getting your G.C. currently is light getting a mint to print money. Definately a demand out there right now. 

That’s why I like Mike Rowe and how he pushes trades over college. I went to college and got my masters degree, but if I had to do it all over again, sometimes I wonder what life (and my stress level) would be like. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote WillysWally Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Jan. 2023 at 2:05am
A Very Early Good Morning to Everyone:

Have any of you heard of the 721 rule aka the 127 rule?  In general especially if you are looking organizationally, at the manufacturing sector, for every 10 people that you hire, 7 of them will be skilled or semiskilled production workers, i.e. the trades.  Of the remaining 3 people,  two will probably need a bachelors degree and one person will need a Masters degree to support the 7 tradesmen.  While every organization, industry, or situation is different, it does illustrate an approximate ratio of college degrees vs the number of trained skilled or semiskilled folks needed.

To illustrate the ever growing gap in the number of trades available, vs the number that are needed, there is a land mark study conducted by the Allegheny Conference, a collective of the local Chambers of Commerce in the Pittsburgh Area, known as Inflection Point.  It was published in 2015 and upgraded in 2017.  The bottom line of the studies was simply this -- In the 10 county region surrounding Pittsburgh, 30,000 highly skilled, technical workers were going to retire each and every year for the next 10 years as the Baby Boomers reached the end of their careers and age out of the work force.  At the same time, the high schools in that same 10 county region will graduate an average of 27,000 students per year.  Over that same period of time there will be a total of 30,000 less workers potentially available to replace the baby boomers exiting the work force.

The bottom line is that we are going to continue to come up short for the foreseeable future.

Good night all.

Regards,

Walter

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