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General roominess question? |
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BD1 
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Joined: 18 Dec. 2019 Location: Maine Status: Offline Points: 629 |
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 Topic: General roominess question?Posted: 09 Jan. 2022 at 7:38pm |
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I have been accumulating bits and pieces for another CJ build. So far I have a NT dana 30, flanged offset dana 44, 225 dauntless, SM 465 and a dana 20, (for a "super"18). A lot of this stuff came with a '55 CJ5 project I bought. I have sat in the CJ5 and I do like the extra roominess compared to my CJ2a, more leg room, easier to get in and out of it, easier to see out the higher windshield. But, it's not a flat fender. Somehow it just doesn't make it for me esthetically. So my question is, how does a CJ3a, or M38 fit into the roominess scale? Is it somewhere between a CJ2a and a CJ5? Closer to the CJ5? Closer to the CJ2a? Is this quantifiable? Anybody know the relative dimensions off hand? How far can I go with this build on a CJ5 before I need to make that decision?
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BD
'47 CJ2a, Shiny on top! '55 CJ5 project |
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duffer
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Joined: 02 Feb. 2012 Location: Bozeman, MT Status: Offline Points: 1085 |
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Posted: 09 Jan. 2022 at 7:43pm |
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Exactly the same space deficit disorder. However, the M38 gets you a glovebox. The 3B is also the same except for some extra space under the hood.
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1955 3B: 441sbc,AGE 4 speed transmission, Teralow D18w/Warn OD, 4.11:1 D44's/ARB's, glass tub & fenders, aluminum hood/grill, 8274, York OBA, Premier Power Welder; 67 CJ5: 225,T86AA, D18, 4.88's, OD
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BD1
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Joined: 18 Dec. 2019 Location: Maine Status: Offline Points: 629 |
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Posted: 09 Jan. 2022 at 8:08pm |
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So the 2a and 3a are the same interior dimensions? The thing I think I would really like about the M38 is the ability to unscrew the instrument cluster and pull it out to work on it. Working up behind the dash on my 2a is my least favorite thing about it.
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BD
'47 CJ2a, Shiny on top! '55 CJ5 project |
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IronAge52
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Joined: 22 Aug. 2016 Location: San Diego Status: Offline Points: 257 |
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Posted: 09 Jan. 2022 at 8:21pm |
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most people 6 foot plus notch out the rear wheel house behind the driver side and passenger side of their flat fender Jeeps. the 3 inch or so makes a big difference. cruisee around the modified forums. i am sure you can see what other people have done to make their Flat fender jeeps usable.
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gearwrencher
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Rus Curtis
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Joined: 25 Mar. 2010 Location: Alabama Status: Offline Points: 1733 |
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Posted: 09 Jan. 2022 at 8:38pm |
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Weren't the seats moved back when the wheel wells were shortened? Was that with the CJ-3A? The 3A w/s glass is up higher (same as the 3B).
Dimensions (I thought I'd seen this type of info for the 2A but that brain cell is gone): |
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Rus Curtis
Alabama 1954 CJ3B Bantam T3-C |
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wfopete
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Posted: 09 Jan. 2022 at 9:10pm |
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Yup ^^^ I think you gained an extra inch or so of leg room with a 3A.
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Suffer Fools, Gladly!
U.S. Army Iraq Veteran (ret.) |
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oldtime
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Posted: 09 Jan. 2022 at 10:03pm |
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2A vs. 3A/B and 5
The 2A rear wheelhouse is 2” longer at 34” and also the seat frames were changed to fit, so expect about 2 more inches of legroom in the 3A and 3B. Not sure if there is any drivers area difference between a 3B and the early 5. Minimal at best. But post 1968 5’s have the w/s glass arched at top for increased visability.
Edited by oldtime - 09 Jan. 2022 at 10:06pm |
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Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
T98-A Rock Crawler using exclusive factory parts and Approved Special Equipment from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963) Zero aftermarket parts |
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Oldpappy
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Posted: 09 Jan. 2022 at 10:08pm |
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More like 3" gain I think. I am a larger guy, 6'2" and 250 lbs, so I am big around the middle and broad across the rump. I feel your pain.
I had a M38 about 30 years ago, but I was a lot thinner then. My CJ2A was a tight fit, but when I installed a new steering gear it had the longer shaft. Now, at first thought one might think a longer steering column would mean eve less room, but the way it worked out for me was the steering wheel is no longer rubbing my belly, and I have plenty of room. It is harder to get in and out of than the CJ5 I have, but once in the seat I have plenty of room. I have thinner than stock bottom cushions in my CJ2A, and no seat back cushions and this adds a lot to the room, and I am comfortable enough.
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If you can't get there in a Jeep you don't need to be there!
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43 Flat-Fender
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Joined: 22 Sep. 2020 Location: Louisville, KY Status: Offline Points: 112 |
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Posted: 10 Jan. 2022 at 5:58pm |
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BD1 ..... given the topic of roominess in Flat Fenders .... I can tell you with confidence, you would not be happy sitting in an MB/GPW.
 A CJ2A, in comparison, feels like Cadillac with the raised and tilted back seat!
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Rob
GPW 94445 (DOD 01-25-43) Built in Louisville KY Engine: MB341746 "Faithful Steed" since 1967 |
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gostby
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Posted: 10 Jan. 2022 at 6:44pm |
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Used to be a guy on here named Les Barger, I think, who had an extended 2a. I haven't seen any recent posts by him but maybe by looking him up in the archives you might find some info. Gary
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gostby
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gostby
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Posted: 10 Jan. 2022 at 6:55pm |
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Make that Les Berg, not Barger. My mistake. Gary
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gostby
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3A Steve
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Posted: 10 Jan. 2022 at 7:02pm |
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Daryl Bensinger in PA had a MB (GPW?) at the Colorado Fall Color Tour in September that he took to the Normandy Beach anniversary a few years ago. It has a 4" lengthened frame. Said no one there noticed the extra length and it certainly looks right. He did it to better fit him. You could check with him at Bensinger Jeeps.
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Mark W.
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Posted: 10 Jan. 2022 at 7:19pm |
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An early CJ5 is 2.5" longer in the Tub between the raiser and the tailgate. Other then that they are the same size as a 2A 3A 3B The seats in a 3A and 3B are set back a little with more of an angle to the back giving a little more belly room and maybe a little more leg room. The early CJ5 is pretty much the same the later ones have adjustable seats but still fit in the same space. They are all exactly the same 57.125" wide through the body. |
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Oldpappy
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Posted: 10 Jan. 2022 at 9:04pm |
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The CJ3A and M38 Jeeps had a shorter wheel house as Ken mentioned, and the seat frames are longer than on a CJ2A. So, there is more room to move the seat back in a CJ3A, CJ3B than in a CJ2A. The extra 2.5" length in a CJ5 tub is because the frame is longer.
I have used a M38 driver side seat frame in a CJ2A with a notched wheel house to gain more room, and am thinking about doing the same with the CJ2A I currently have. Other than the longer leg the M38 / CJ3A seat frame looks the same as a CJ2A frame, and they are cost less than half what the lengthened seat frame Besinger sells. I am big around the middle like Daryl. A side step also makes them easier to get into.
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If you can't get there in a Jeep you don't need to be there!
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Mark W.
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Posted: 10 Jan. 2022 at 11:05pm |
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the change in wheel base is only an inch. My 2A tub is on a CJ5 frame.
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Oldpappy
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Posted: 10 Jan. 2022 at 11:54pm |
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I wasn't talking about "wheel base", but the length of the frame.
Where do you suppose the extra 2.5" between the floor riser and tailgate you mentioned comes from? The CJ5 has longer springs than the earlier CJ2A-CJ3B series. I happen to have a 67 CJ5 chassis, and a late 48 CJ2A frame out in the barn, and would be glad to measure them for you.
Edited by Oldpappy - 11 Jan. 2022 at 12:00am |
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If you can't get there in a Jeep you don't need to be there!
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cpt logger
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Posted: 11 Jan. 2022 at 12:36am |
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I do not know about Mark W. but I would like to see those measurements.
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Mark W.
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Posted: 11 Jan. 2022 at 3:06am |
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I have said many times the early CJ-5 frame is 2.5" longer from the riser to the tailgate or rear of the tub. I know I had to cut that much off to get my early CJ5 frame to fit my CJ-2A frame. The rear floor in a 2A 3A 3B is 39" long from Riser to the rear edge. Having had a 2A tub on a 5 frame for over 40 years it was pretty obvious. This is why the whole ass end of CHUG is changed so it will fit the shorter tub. That said I know not how the seats are setup in an Early CJ5 or any CJ5 for that matter. But on an early CJ5 I do know the Riser is in the same place within small fractions of an inch of where its at in a 2A 3A 3B |
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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