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Generator Washers ????

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Holy Toledo View Drop Down
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    Posted: 01 Feb. 2011 at 6:18pm

Hello all,

  Just chumming the water today.  As I restore my original generator projects, I have had to make the simple fender-style washers that sandwich the rubber generator bushings.  The washers I was to have had where lost over the years and replaced with incorrect ordinary fender washers.  I spent a small amount of time trying to locate accurate replacements or thinking about modifying existing extra thick fender washers.  I finally concluded that punching out accurate copies of these parts would be a wiser course to take.

 

  Here is my question,  "Are there Forum members out there who would like me to punch out a few extra washers to purchase/barter for your needs? " 

  

 According to the CJ-2A Parts List on this site, a properly installed generator will require (2) A-1401  WASHER, flat, 21/64" I.D. and  (2) A-1396 WASHER, flat, 33/64" I.D. washers.  The picture below will give you a better visual on what I am talking about.   The picture only shows 1/2  the required washers.  It only shows the engine-mounted generator bracket assembly.  What is not shown in the photograph is the opposite generator attaching point encompassed into  the design of the passenger side motor mount.

   At the top of the photograph's  is a pseudo-exploded drawing of the bolt assemblies .  Washer A-1396 is the second part in from the left.  Washer A-1401 is the fourth part in from the left.  For clarity, I have included the completed the engine-mounted generator assembly , minus the generator, in the lower portion of the photograph.

 Let me know if there is interest in these washers and I will be able to gauge  the interest and work up a price/ barter schedule.  I am confident that they will be inexpensive in price.



Joel
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote uglyjeep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Feb. 2011 at 6:33pm
Hi Joel, I am in for a set or two.
 
Daniel
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Feb. 2011 at 4:14pm
Joel, I'm in for 1 set.

Were you aware that the small ID has a chamfered hole?


I thought Ron F had these, but haven't checked into it.

Sean
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote samcj2a Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Feb. 2011 at 4:29pm
I would like 2 sets.
Sam

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote damar2yxr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Feb. 2011 at 7:10pm
Put me down for 4 sets!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Roger B Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Feb. 2011 at 10:26am
2 sets please.
 
Roger
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bob777 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb. 2011 at 7:34pm
What would be the purpose of the chamfered hole??? Ease of assembly???
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Feb. 2011 at 5:45pm
Bob:
Quote What would be the purpose of the chamfered hole??? Ease of assembly???
Well, depends on who you ask I guess.

Over on the "G", they say it's a "funnel" for guiding the bolt through the hole.  It is a very close fit, so that's a valid reason.

In my opinion, it's there to provide clearance to the radius between threaded stud & shoulder (same thing that they do on the front crankshaft thrust washer).

I've been PMing w/Joel about it.  He says his bolts don't have a radius.  Mine certainly do (.030-.035"), and with that washer hole explicitly spec'd at 21/64", without the chamfer, it would not fit flush to the shoulder on my bolts.

Sean
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Holy Toledo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Feb. 2011 at 12:52am
Hi all,
  
  These "simple washers" have become more than just stamping out a few pieces of steel. I have been PM'ing with Sean, talking with Ron on the G, and trying to be less confused on what the purpose(s) of the chamfer is about on the A-1401 washer.  There now appears to be different designs for generator bolts, rubber bushings, and washer specs out there.  To make washers to fit and work properly for you would be require me to make it a custom order for each generator you wanted to mount.  
  
  I am hoping Sean will accept the challenge of starting a new research thread on these two washers, A-1401 and A-1396,  with the idea to gather some solid evidence as to what is what.

  Personally, from this proposed thread,  I would like to know specs on NOS generator bolts, rubber bushings, and the two styles of washers.  Then I think we will need to gather the same specs for what is being offered for sale as repops on these generator mounting parts.  This will allow us to continue to mount our generators with the NOS, Repops, or combination of these parts into the future. Confused?  It should become clearer with a few nifty drawings Sean has.

  Sorry I have spoken too soon on making these washers, it was always my intent  to make these washers so they will work properly on your application as well as mine.   Give me a little time to figure out what is more correct.  Help us figure this puzzle out with some data.
  
  
Joel
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Feb. 2011 at 3:02pm
I'll be starting a "request for data" in the research section.  May not need to now.

Have to finalize a few drawings first though, will try to get that done today.

Sean


Edited by sean - 08 Feb. 2011 at 4:13pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Feb. 2011 at 4:42pm
After "dumpster diving" into unsorted parts piles, I found more originals parts!  (and discovered incorrect dimension repro bushings!  Imagine that LOL)

Photos will enlarge.

A-1397 bolts have the same .030" radius as the previous bolts:




A-1401 small-hole washers are chamfered, just like the ones depicted on the G.  Note the narrow circular contact patch where the washer rested against the bolt shoulder.

1.130" (+/- .005) OD
0.330" ID
0.090" thick


the other side:


So the chamfer can serve both as a bolt guide, and to insure no interference with the radiused shoulder.

A-1396 large hole washer.  Note the circular contact patch from the bolt head:

1.125" OD
0.510" ID
0.085-0.090" thick



Bushings:  I have 1 NOS and 1 repro.  The repro is .050" longer than NOS.  Joel has a repro that is .100" longer than NOS!  These "too long" repros could cause installation difficulties.  The DO have to crush when the nut is fastened down.



The general idea:



  • NOS bushing would crush by .032"
  • repro-1 would require .082" crush
  • repro-2 would require .132" crush!
These are fairly hard bushings, IMO, the repros would require too much crush, specially that last one!

Gotta run for the day, but will have more drawings & thoughts later.

Sean


Edited by sean - 11 Feb. 2011 at 10:01pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ross Pursifull Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Feb. 2011 at 2:53am
I'll take two sets.  I wanna support  this professional effort.

Nice drawing.  Once one sees the drawing, the chamfer is obviously needed because it clears the fillet on bolt step.

I'll need to look at my rock stock CJ2A to see what I have, but it is really cold in my garage.

Walck should buy your extra stock after you go through this work.
Ross Pursifull
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sean Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Feb. 2011 at 10:03pm
More photos, drawings & details in the Parts Project:

Generator Support
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rpatowers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Dec. 2016 at 5:56am
Fellas, did anything ever come of this effort? Were any of these washers produced? Does anyone sell them now?

As you may guess, I need two sets for my CJ 2a Generator.

Thanks!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ndnchf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Dec. 2017 at 10:39pm
Dredging up an old thread. I realized my generator was not well mounted, so started researching and ended up here. So, did anyone make these washers?

 


Edited by ndnchf - 16 Dec. 2017 at 10:45pm
1948 CJ2A - It goes nowhere fast, but anywhere slow.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joe Friday Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Dec. 2017 at 12:45am
Ron Fitzpatrick sells them but they may be a part of a kit.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ndnchf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Dec. 2017 at 12:55am
ok - thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ndnchf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Dec. 2017 at 11:44am
I ordered the washers and special bolts, as well as a few other things from RF. I probably wouldn't have known there was a problem with mine. But I noticed the generator was cocked a little, not quite parallel to the engine. So i crawled underneath and found the bolts loose and one close to falling out.

I can't help but wonder why Willys felt the need to use this complicated mounting system. I've owned quite a few antique cars and trucks over the years. They all had generators using the same basic mounting layout, but all just used a solid bolt up mount, no rubber bushings, special bolts/washers. I can't imagine the go-devil vibrated more than other engines of the era. Perhaps it was a carryover military requirement from the MB era. It had to be more expensive to manufacture this way.

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