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Pieces in the oil pan

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jpet View Drop Down
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    Posted: 27 Oct. 2021 at 8:50pm




Hi all,

I have an L134 motor that I saw run and drive before it was pulled out of a 3A. I took the oil pan off to change the gasket and I found these pieces in the oil pan. At first I thought it might be the crank shaft thrust washer but this one has no damage:



I have the head off the motor it looks to be freshly rebuilt. Bored with no ridge valve seats look great.

Does anyone have an idea what these pieces could be? Thanks!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Oct. 2021 at 9:01pm
Looks a lot like the camshaft thrust plate spacer.
Goes between the bronze thrust plate and the camshaft…..
Thin ring about 3/16 tall and 3/16” thick. 
Made of cast and it has a 45* bevel on the ID….
Not sure what the two larger chunks seen in pic could be .



Edited by oldtime - 27 Oct. 2021 at 9:05pm
Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Oct. 2021 at 9:03pm


Part G?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Oct. 2021 at 9:06pm
That’s my best guess not sure what the two large chunks of metal are…
Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Oldpappy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Oct. 2021 at 9:07pm
I had the same thought as Ken on what it looks like, but I cannot imagine what would cause one of them to shatter like that, nor how the pieces especially the bigger ones would make it into the bottom of the oil pan.
If you can't get there in a Jeep you don't need to be there!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Oct. 2021 at 9:11pm
The bevel is supposed to go up against the radius on the camshaft.
Maybe someone put it in backwards causing the ring to crack when pressed up against the camshaft.
Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Oldpappy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Oct. 2021 at 9:14pm
If that is a disintegrated spacer I am thinking the larger pieces may be chunks off the cam bearing. I for sure would be pulling the gear and retainer off that cam to take a look. You obviously have the timing cover off, and if it were that spacer I am surprised you didn't find debris in the bottom of that cover.

Edited by Oldpappy - 27 Oct. 2021 at 9:16pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Oct. 2021 at 9:26pm
The front cam bearing is steel backed babbit. 
If the two large pieces were bronze that would be the camshaft thrust plate itself.
Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Oct. 2021 at 9:42pm
Originally posted by Oldpappy Oldpappy wrote:

....You obviously have the timing cover off, and if it were that spacer I am surprised you didn't find debris in the bottom of that cover.
the bottom of the timing cover is open and has a flange that bolts to the bottom of the pan. So debris in the timing cover would drop into the oil pan. I’ll pull the gear and let you know what I discover. Thanks!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joe Friday Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Oct. 2021 at 10:39pm
641049 Camshaft gear thrust plate spacer.

Haven't figured out the big pieces.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Oldpappy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Oct. 2021 at 11:20pm
Yes, you are right about it being open at bottom. It has been a while, about 30 years, since I have been inside one of these engines, probably thinking of some other engine. 

I am about to get a refresher course on one though as I will be building a L134 for my "MB Clone".

Very interested in what you find behind that gear. 

I think Ken may have a good guess about what would happen if the spacer were put in backwards.

If it is what it seems to be, it may not have caused much damage other than to the cam bearing and plate, so the engine may still be okay.

Probably better than finding pieces of piston skirt in the pan. 


Edited by Oldpappy - 27 Oct. 2021 at 11:27pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Oct. 2021 at 12:13am
You’ll want to remove the valves so you can pull the camshaft out for inspection.
Without the spacer intact the camshaft would be allowed to move back and forth too much. 
Inspect the lobe faces and such. 
You may then be able to determine what the larger metal chunks are.
Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bruce W Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Oct. 2021 at 12:57am
  Sure look like pieces of the spacer, but I’m wondering how they could get out of the space behind the gear, inside the thrust plate. If the larger pieces are thrust plate, we’ll, that answers that question. 
BW 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Oct. 2021 at 5:30am
I know I’m being lazy here, (asking before looking it up), but does a chain drive motor have the same pieces? If so, I can steel the parts from another motor.

Edit: looks like the answer is no

Edited by jpet - 28 Oct. 2021 at 5:55am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lee MN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Oct. 2021 at 6:58am
Originally posted by jpet jpet wrote:

I know I’m being lazy here, (asking before looking it up), but does a chain drive motor have the same pieces? If so, I can steel the parts from another motor.

Edit: looks like the answer is no


Jeff if you need any of theses parts from a gear driven engine let me know, I have plenty on hand and your welcome to them.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Oct. 2021 at 7:24am
Thanks Lee. It is the thrust washer and retainer plate. that are broken I'll post pics in a bit.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Oldpappy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Oct. 2021 at 7:49am
Chain Drive cam engines have a spring loaded plunger attached to the timing cover. I don't remember for sure if they have a similar thrust plate, but I don't think they do. 

I have one out in the shed with the cover and sprockets off. We are heading into town this morning to buy the wife a new car, but I will take a look at that engine when we get back from town.

I have some extra gear drive L134 engines, so let me know if you need any parts.



Edited by Oldpappy - 28 Oct. 2021 at 7:50am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Oct. 2021 at 8:28am
You guys should write detective novels





Lee is sending me the parts.

I suppose I could make the hold down plate but not the spacer
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