Poll: Military tribute or original? |
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Oldpappy
Member Joined: 09 Apr. 2018 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 4921 |
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My project Jeep is a 1948 CJ2A. The body was too far gone for me to want to attempt fixing it, so I decided to buy a reproduction body.
Turned out the dealer near me only had the MB bodies. I have had several CJs in the past, but have always wanted a WW2 Jeep like my two uncles had when I was a kid. They brought those Jeeps on hunting trips and let us boys run around the ridges with tehm. So, I learned to drive in a Ford GPW and a Willys MB. One of my uncles fought in the Battle of the Bulge (6th Cavalry), so I decided to build my Jeep as a tribute to his service. So, instead of just buying the tub, I bought a whole body. I am not trying to fool anyone, just building the kind of Jeep I want to build. I am sure the Jeep police will be able to spot what it is, but that doesn't matter to me one bit, and probably 90% of folks don't know the difference. It is my money, will be my Jeep, and I will be the one who enjoys it.
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SE Kansas 46 CJ-2A
Member Sponsor Member x 3 Joined: 22 Jan. 2016 Location: S.E. Kansas Status: Offline Points: 3192 |
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"...and probably 90% of folks don't know the difference."
Make that 99.999%, the only ones that will know are other flatfender owners. At least half of them won't say anything about it, but there is always a few who can't stand to keep quiet and will call you on it. don't pay attention to them. It is yours to do what you want. Using 99.999% as an example, out of 100,000 people only 10 would know the difference anyway. Only 5 would make a big deal about it. Go for it. |
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46 CJ-2A #64462 "Ol' Red" (bought April 1969)(second owner)(12 V, 11" brakes, M-38 frame, MD Juan tub)
U.S. Coast Guard Chief Petty Officer(ret.) U.S. Army Vietnam veteran and damned proud of it. |
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Oldpappy
Member Joined: 09 Apr. 2018 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 4921 |
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Half those that do know what it is will likely only be about half right.
The steering bell crank is mounted to the cross member, which is a dead giveaway that it isn't a real MB, but there are other things that will likely throw off even some of the experts. My CJ2A came off the line very late in 1948. It was built on the same frame they were building CJ3A Jeeps on at that time, but it is the CJ2A version as the motor mounts are not staggered as with the 3A and M38. So, I expect if any do speak up about it, they will think it is a MB clone built on a 3A or 3B frame, based on the frame horns and missing gussets, but they will be wrong about that. The engine I plan to use is a post war chain drive engine, which as far as I can tell was probably a government contract replacement engine. It is too old to be a late CJ engine, and not old enough to be a WW2 engine or even a first year CJ2 engine. The axles I have are NOS M38-A1 axles which were sold as surplus from a Marine base. With the possible exception of the engine, these are the only actual military parts on the Jeep, but I bet most will think they are from a late civilian Jeep. It may be salad, but it will be fun. |
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Ol' Unreliable
Member Joined: 25 Sep. 2016 Location: CO Springs CO Status: Offline Points: 4226 |
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When I first got Ol' Unreliable, I was going to find an MB grille and make the swap. The more I thought about it though, I decided that it wasn't an MB and never would be an MB, so I wouldn't fake it. So that's what my two cents would be: a CJ isn't an MB and never will be. Painting a 2A OD is acceptable, as it was a color option, but it's still not an MB. Besides, there were so many more MB/GPWs made than 2As, so the 2A is the rarer bird. Still and all, it IS your Jeep. I personally wouldn't want a clone, but that's just me.
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There's a reason it's called Ol' Unreliable
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Oldpappy
Member Joined: 09 Apr. 2018 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 4921 |
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If I could have anything I wanted I would have a perfect CJ2A, a Willys MB, and a Ford GPW. I would also have the 56 Chevy I had in high school and a model A Ford. It just isn't a perfect world.
All I have right now is the Jeep I am building, and at my age and condition I don't know how many more of these builds I have time for. If I add another Jeep or two to my stable it will probably be because I either find one in good original shape, or one someone else has already restored. After what I have spent on my project Jeep so far, the asking price of restored Jeeps is beginning to look a lot more reasonable than it did when I started this. In this part of the country finding one of these old Jeeps that is not a complete rust bucket is a rare thing, and finding one with a decent body and original drive train is an even more rare thing. But they do occaisionally show up. A fellow I know got one a few years ago from the widow of the original owner. It was a CJ3B, always kept in a dry garage with a concrete floor. It is grey with red wheels, and that baby is in top shape. It even came with a nice Bantam trailer. The high hood 3B is not my favorite, but it was so nice I offered him twice what he paid for it. He wasn't a bit interested in selling it.
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LuzonRed47
Member Joined: 11 Apr. 2007 Location: Plymouth, MI Status: Offline Points: 842 |
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Ol' Unreliable: Not sure I'd bet that CJ2As are rarer today than MBs. I'd reckon that in the U.S., more of the roughly 214K 2As produced still exist than do MBs and GPWs, even though more of the latter were made. Most wartime jeeps were shipped overseas and did not return to the States. Scores of those jeeps not destroyed in combat or otherwise totaled/not repairable were scrapped or (as was common in the Pacific theater) dumped into the sea. Early post-war CJs suffered no combat attrition. As an MB owner friend tells me, if you want to find WW2 jeeps, go to France or Britain. Having said that, recently while driving in rural Arizona I saw an MB or GPW sitting next to a barn on a small farm.
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CJ2A #140275 "Ziggie" (purchased new by my dad in 1947)
ACM #124334 CJ3A windshield, Warn Overdrive 1953 Strick M100 trailer Serial #18253 |
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Mark W.
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7986 |
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That's ok if one of the hard core Jeep Police ever see CHUG at a show I should be able to give them an aneurysm Frame from a CJ5 Tub looks like a cross between a 2A and a 3A engine from a DJ-3A, reproduction parts and maybe 100 parts I made myself Parts from at least 28 different Jeeps from a 1946 2A to a 68 Wagoneer and 71 CJ5 and performance after market parts. My comment will be I built it where's yours. DO what you like with YOUR jeep no one has to like it but you and maybe the Wife (sure makes it easier when they do) They aren't rare (well except for a few few examples) a near perfectly restored 2A or 3A is not hard to find. nor are ones that your hard pressed to find much past a grill and hood that still look like Willys had anything to do with creating it. And everything in between.
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Cheapsnake
Member Joined: 17 Oct. 2019 Location: Door County, WI Status: Offline Points: 125 |
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I dropped a V8 into a Porsche 914 and the Porsche people went batsh*t crazy. I'm ready for the Jeep Police.
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I was hooked on the Hokey Pokey, but then I turned myself around.
'46 cj-2a (WIP) '66 Factory Five Cobra 1980 Triumph TR8 |
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Ol' Unreliable
Member Joined: 25 Sep. 2016 Location: CO Springs CO Status: Offline Points: 4226 |
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And not only that, but !
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There's a reason it's called Ol' Unreliable
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IRQVET
Member Joined: 03 Sep. 2019 Location: Tallahassee, FL Status: Offline Points: 423 |
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All I'm saying with a CJ done up like a military rig, an argument could be made for stolen valor . . . but I can also see the argument of its your Jeep so build what you want. Personally, I couldn't do it. It would just feel wrong.
Edited by IRQVET - 26 Feb. 2020 at 5:18am |
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Dean
Operation Iraqi Freedom Veteran 49' CJ2A w/ GPA Engine #8924 67 CJ5 (Sold) |
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northcoastsailor
Member Joined: 30 May 2018 Location: California Status: Offline Points: 58 |
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I'd say:
1. It's a piece of metal, not a human being who actually sacrificed something. 2. "Stolen valour" would really only apply if someone did it up as a military jeep and proclaimed it as being a military jeep. Do reenactors or Hollywood get accused of stolen valor for portraying different people? I say do what makes you happy, but don't try and lie to anyone about what you have.
Edited by northcoastsailor - 26 Feb. 2020 at 5:37pm |
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Oldpappy
Member Joined: 09 Apr. 2018 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 4921 |
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IRQVET, If you look up "Valor" or "Valour" in the dictionary I believe you must agree it has nothing to do with a machine. I assume your avatar name is an indication you served in Iraq, if so thank you for your service. My son-in-law served two tours in that place. It is okay with me if you don't like the idea of something like that, but it is not okay with me to infer I have anything at all to do with anything as repulsive as "Stolen Valor". I think his service is worth rememberance and tribute, whether you see it that way or not.
Edited by Oldpappy - 26 Feb. 2020 at 1:44pm |
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athawk11
Member Joined: 18 Jan. 2012 Location: Arvada,Colorado Status: Offline Points: 4151 |
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I think it's crazy to militarize a civilian Jeep.
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1- 1946 CJ2A
2- 1949 CJ3A |
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Cheapsnake
Member Joined: 17 Oct. 2019 Location: Door County, WI Status: Offline Points: 125 |
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Damn, I should have picked a topic a little less controversial, like politics or religion.
As for "stolen valor", nobody is trying to be a wannabe warrior. It's simply a tribute to those who served, both men and machines. BTW, I'm a Viet Nam Marine. Does that give me permission? Edited by Cheapsnake - 26 Feb. 2020 at 2:02pm |
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I was hooked on the Hokey Pokey, but then I turned myself around.
'46 cj-2a (WIP) '66 Factory Five Cobra 1980 Triumph TR8 |
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Oldpappy
Member Joined: 09 Apr. 2018 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 4921 |
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Some think it is crazy to militarize a civilian.
I think the topic is controversial enough to be interesting, but not really enough to get folks all riled up. I grew up in a military family, and was raised with a certain sense of honor driven down deep. There are certain things I cannot abide, which may prompt an angry response. I appologize if this offended anyone, not meant to.
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RICKG
Member Joined: 08 Jan. 2015 Location: so idaho Status: Offline Points: 1941 |
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I never met a mule I didn't like!
MC51986 "OD MULE" DOD 01-52 '50 CJ3A "Bucksnort". Keep 'em Rollin' |
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Kinnett
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 16 Aug. 2018 Location: Williamsburg VA Status: Offline Points: 94 |
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I am former military and while I don't think it's crazy to build a military tribute, my vote is to keep a civilian CJ in civvies. Post war civilian jeeps are cool and many people who stop to talk are surprised to learn that they even exist.
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athawk11
Member Joined: 18 Jan. 2012 Location: Arvada,Colorado Status: Offline Points: 4151 |
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Was hoping one of you would come along eventually.
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1- 1946 CJ2A
2- 1949 CJ3A |
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