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R&R Gearboxes without removing engine

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smfulle View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smfulle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: R&R Gearboxes without removing engine
    Posted: 25 Nov. 2018 at 8:20pm
Over the years that I have followed this forum there have been several questions about removing the Transmission and transfer case assembly. Should you do it one gearbox at a time? Should you leave the bell housing on the engine? Is it easier to remove the entire drive train in one piece? 

I have had many of these same questions and have tried most of the options. I thought I would post up step by step of how I like to get the gear boxes out. I'm doing this job to try and slow down some of the leaking that I have.

Before you start, its a good idea to take your jeep to the local car wash, or break out your pressure washer and try and knock what grease and mud you can off of the underside of your rig. This can make it so you don't get quite as much dirt in your eyes or down your neck. You'll still get some, but not as much. Doing it at the car wash leaves all that grease and dirt there instead of in your driveway.

Drain all the gear oil out of the transmission and transfer case. If you fail to do this step, when you actually get the boxes out you will have gear oil everywhere instead of nicely contained in your drain pan (don't ask me how I know this).

Disconnect everything under the jeep that is attached to the transmission and transfer case. 
This includes:
-both driveshafts, I disconnect them from both ends so that I can get them out of the way.
-stay cable
-clutch return spring
-clutch cable that goes into the bell housing disconnect from cross tube (parts list calls this tube "lever and tube, control", but I'm calling it a cross tube.) 
-clutch rod, disconnect from cross tube
-unbolt cross tube ball stud from frame and remove cross tube
-speedometer cable
-Parking brake cable (mines gone so I didn't have to do this)
_overdrive shift linkage if you have it.
Next I go to the top and start removing all the shift covers, the transfer case shift pin and levers, the overdrive shift lever, and the transmission shift tower. 
In my case removing the transfer case shifter pin is made quite a bit easier by a custom modification made by one of my uncles, a handy hole in the transmission tunnel that gives access to the shifter pin.

You can see the hole here in this picture. When I fixed the rusted out floor I considered closing up this hole but decided that it was too handy a modification to do away with. Someday I might make a cover for it, but probably not.

 

Here I have all the shifters and linkages stripped off. I can see here that part of my leaking problem is probably coming right from the shift tower. I hate really gluing that thing down because it's hard to get off, but I guess I'll have to try a different something to stop the leaking here.


Disconnect your negative battery cable (probably should have done this sooner, but I always forget), then disconnect the cable from the starter and remove the starter.  (you can see from this picture that I didn't follow my own counsel and wash things off first, lots of dirt in my eyes)


If you  haven't already, put your jeep on some jack stands and get it in the air a bit so that when you lower the gear boxes they will slide out from under the jeep without getting hung up on the frame, springs, body, exhaust, etc. causing you to use bad words that you don't want your grand kids to hear. 

Now I pull my floor jack over and put it under the back of the transfer case to hold the assembly up while I remove the cross member. 

First I remove the two nuts that hold the cross member to the transmission mount and the big bolt and nut that holds the cross member to the transfer case. 

Next I unbolt the two bolts on the vertical part of both ends of the cross member (4 bolts all together) leaving only the two bolts on the horizontal part of the cross member ends. (I think 3as and 3bs only have this one bolt and not the two vertical ones.) 

I now remove the two bolts on the horizontal part, leaving the drive train assembly resting on the floor jack under the tail of the transfer case. 

In this picture you can almost see my floor jack holding everything up.


Next task is to remove the top bolts on the bell housing to engine. I have tried several different methods to do this and hated most of them . I have removed the motor mounts to drop the engine down a few inches. I have twisted my hands into knots to get two end wrenches on the nut and bolt and only been able move it a fraction of a turn at a time.  This space is really tight, especially on the drivers side. 


I have discovered that if you lower the tail end of the transmission/transfer case assembly several inches with the floor jack previously put in place, it actually gives you enough room to get a socket with an extension (and sometimes a wobbly attachment) onto the bolt through the transmission tunnel opening. 

With the back of the engine a little lower as it pivots on the motor mounts, there is enough room to get a box end wrench on the nut side by the firewall. If you have a helper they can hold that wrench for you while you loosen with the ratchet, but I found that I could do it myself by putting the box end wrench on the nut and letting it hang there and then working the ratchet from the other side and when the nut comes off the end wrench just falls off to the floor.

Here's where my ratchet goes to get on the top drivers side bolt. The passenger side is even easier to get to. 

You will also notice in this picture that I cut a piece of cardboard to cover the transmission opening to try and keep at least some of the dirt and gunk from getting in there. I just used a couple of the tower bolts to hold it on. 


Next thing I do is prop up the back of the engine with a bottle jack and a piece of wood. I just lift the engine up enough to get the floor jack loose in the back. I like a little bit of downward tilt on the engine to make it easier for the bell  housing to clear the transmission tunnel as it's coming out and going back in.


Now get your transmission jack under there and snugged up to the bottom of the assembly. I have used my floor jack for this on several occasions and it works, but I like the transmission jack much better. Not so much of a circus act trying to balance the assembly on the little plate of the floor jack while jacking with my foot ...


Now remove the rest of the bolts holding the bell housing to the engine. I actually get them all out but one before I put the transmission jack in there, just because there is more room.

Now slide the assembly out. It always takes me some prying and muttering to get it out. This time I had the transmission jack a little too high and the assembly was on a bind and wouldn't come out until I lowered it a little. 

The assembly's  odd shape and awkward balance point make it hard to keep on the Jack so stay alert so you don't catch the thing on your chest when. and if, it rolls off the jack as you let it down. 

Here is the greasy lump in all it's glory. 

I like to stand it on the bell housing end and disassemble it from he back to the front. Standing it on the end keeps the transmission main shaft assembly from coming apart when you remove the transfer case and then dropping all the needle bearing in the bottom of the case (again, don't ask me how I know this Ouch.)




If anyone has any other tricks or additions that they would like to make to this, please feel free to add on. 

Grampa's Jeep is the one and only flat fender I have ever owned, driven, or worked on and all the above I have learned by putting the gearbox assembly in and out many different times, mostly because I didn't know what I was doing and had to take it back out to fix something I didn't do correctly the first time. So I'm sure that there are some more experienced heads out there that can correct anything I have mislead on.

I would especially welcome some input on what secrets you have for getting the transfer case shift lever pin out. Because of my custom pin access hole I have not had as much trouble with this process as some do. 




Stan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ndnchf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov. 2018 at 8:50pm
Excellent description and photos, thanks for sharing. I need to print this out for future reference.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lowenuf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov. 2018 at 9:39pm
Stan, I just installed a rebuilt column shift tranny/TC in the '45. While removing the old one, the TC levers always seem to be the prob... Granted, if attention has been given to the pin prior, does make it a lot easier, as was my case.... But for those that do not know, if you can get the pin to move, remove the grease zert, and start moving the pin out, at the halfway point the left lever lifts out, then slide the right lever over to the left and it comes out, and the pin should still be 1/4" from hitting the floor pan.....
45 #10012
45 #10033 ACM #47
45 #10163 ACM #188
57 CJ5    Dauntless V6, T-18 4-speed, D-44 rear/D-30 front, D-20 twin stick



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cal.bar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov. 2018 at 10:38pm
I've done it a few different ways. I've tried to take it all out with the trans/TC and BH all in one piece and also trans separated from the BH first. Latter was easier. And at least as far as my rig is concerned, NO chance of getting the TC, Trans and BH all put back in the vehicle assembled in a single piece, so why not separate stuff as you go and make it easier on yourself.


Edited by cal.bar - 25 Nov. 2018 at 10:42pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smfulle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov. 2018 at 11:08pm
Originally posted by cal.bar cal.bar wrote:

I've done it a few different ways. I've tried to take it all out with the trans/TC and BH all in one piece and also trans separated from the BH first. Latter was easier. And at least as far as my rig is concerned, NO chance of getting the TC, Trans and BH all put back in the vehicle assembled in a single piece, so why not separate stuff as you go and make it easier on yourself.

Interesting take.

My experience has been that separating the bell housing from the transmission before you get the bell housing off is problematic due to the throw out bearing return spring being attached to the transmission on one end and the throw out bearing on the other end because the throw out bearing sits in the bell housing being attached to the throw out fork. I suppose that one could get your fingers down in there and slip the throw out fork off the bearing, but I have never found that necessary.

I have never had any real issues installing the gear boxes assembled as one unit other than getting the awkward shape and weight to balance on the jack. I’ve done it with just a floor jack. If that is all you have to work with, a helper is really nice, but I have done it by myself while waiting for my son-in-law to show up. A transmission jack makes it a lot easier.

When I get that far I’ll update this with some more photos and descriptions of the instal.


Stan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jeeper50 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov. 2018 at 11:21pm
Stan
Have you tried leaving the crossmember attached and have another place to clamp to the trans jack if that what your using. 
Was just researching your topic over on the ECJ5 forum. they leave the bellhousing on also. 
I like your D18 new cover is that to keep the obrien setup covered up? 




Edited by jeeper50 - 25 Nov. 2018 at 11:26pm

Belleview ol skool winch soon.
'48 CJ2A 283 V8 sm 420 granny low, tera low D18, overdrive,lockers

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flatfender Ben Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov. 2018 at 11:39pm
Great write up. 
Thanks for sharing. 
I’ve been lucky on all my Jeeps and the pin wasn’t stuck to bad. 
 As mentioned already the pin doesn’t have to be pulled all the way out to remove the shifters. 
What I learned the hard way is if you remove the pin completely while the t-case is out and then reinstall t-case there’s no way to reinstall the pin without unbolting the cross member and lowering everythingOuch

I used to think tubs had holes cut in them to access the grease zerk on the pin... but after my troubles I think the hole is for reinstalling the PIN!!

So if you don’t have a hole cut in your tub be sure and put the pin in t-case before reinstalling. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ndnchf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Nov. 2018 at 11:45pm
I've read about welding a bar connecting the heads of the two top bellhousing to motor bolts to avoid the problem of accessing the bolt heads. I have no experience with this but it sounds like a good idea. Has anyone tried it?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TateC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Nov. 2018 at 12:53am
I have done it on my Jeeps and it helps a lot although the drivers side is still a pain
Tate Christensen
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cpt logger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Nov. 2018 at 2:07am
IIRC, My uncle drilled some holes in the firewall to be able to get a socket on those engine to bellhousing bolts. They were similar to the hole in the transmission hump to access the aforementioned pin. Those holes were very handy.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smfulle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Nov. 2018 at 2:57am
Originally posted by jeeper50 jeeper50 wrote:

Stan
Have you tried leaving the crossmember attached and have another place to clamp to the trans jack if that what your using. 


Haven’t tried that. I mostly just try to stay out of the way when it rolls off the jack.Smile
I did consider it a time or two, but I thought with how clumsy I am anyway, I would probably have the the cross member knock me out before I could get it down on the ground.
 

Originally posted by jeeper50 jeeper50 wrote:

Stan
Was just researching your topic over on the ECJ5 forum. they leave the bellhousing on also. 
I like your D1v new cover is that to keep the obrien setup covered up? 


That billet aluminum cover was another attempt to stop some leaking. I don’t have the O’Brien gears. Mine are from Tera Flex.
I could not get the original stamped sheet metal cover to stop leaking a cupful of oil every day or so. I was getting ready for a trip and pulling my hair out about the bent leaky cover. I’ve done a little business with Novak and I remember that on their web site they listed this billet aluminum cover that they said would “finally solve those leaky cover problems.”  Novak’s shop is 40 minutes from my house so I jumped in the truck and went up there and got one. 
They are not cheap, but they are pretty when they are not covered in greasy gunk. And it did solve MOST of my leaky cover problems.
Here’s a link to Novak’s D18 parts list. Scroll down a little and you can order one of your very own.





Stan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RA472A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Nov. 2018 at 3:08pm
Great write up.  Thanks.  I've done several of them but you covered things nicely.  I too found leaving the engine in was easier in the long run.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Nov. 2018 at 3:09pm
Stan,

Thanks for the write-up.  Always a challenging weekend to pull, fix and reinstall the transmission and T/C.

Thanks for sharing the info on the billet aluminum cover for the big hole Dana 18 w/ Tera-Low gears.  I have a 1949 build that I guess needs the billet aluminum cover.  Is there anything additional that you have seen / learned that needs to be addressed on the Transmission and T/C?  Will the standard skid plate(s) fit with the billet aluminum cover?
Stev
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smfulle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Nov. 2018 at 3:28pm
Originally posted by Stev Stev wrote:

Stan,

Thanks for the write-up.  Always a challenging weekend to pull, fix and reinstall the transmission and T/C.

Thanks for sharing the info on the billet aluminum cover for the big hole Dana 18 w/ Tera-Low gears.  I have a 1949 build that I guess needs the billet aluminum cover.  Is there anything additional that you have seen / learned that needs to be addressed on the Transmission and T/C?  Will the standard skid plate(s) fit with the billet aluminum cover?

Stev,

Just to clarify, I did not need the bigger cover for the transfer case to clear my Tera Low gears. The stock cover cleared it just fine. I just could not get the stock cover to stop leaking profusely. 

The new cover does hold a bit more gear oil than the stock one, so that is a plus. Especially since I can't seem to make either gear box NOT leak, no matter what I try. 

I was worried when I 1st got the new cover that it might interfere with the stock skid plate, but it does not. In fact, they have the drain plug on the billet cover lined up perfectly with the hole in the stock skid plate so you can drain the transfer case without removing the skid plate. 



Stan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeff_Davis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Nov. 2018 at 3:45pm
If you cut a hole in your tunnel cover for removal of the transfer case shift lever pin (highly recommended!)  buy yourself a TC pin access panel cover that is used on the Willys M38.  They are punched from a thick piece of sheet metal, and have one fixing hole and one slotted hole that can be affixed with two sheet metal screws.  
Just loosen the two screws and slide the cover out of the way to access the pin.  
They'll even work to cover up the misshapen gash carved in the tunnel by a frustrated relative!
Here's a photo of my install:


The Military parts houses have them NOS for about $10 plus shipping.  Or just search for item #332899269201 on flea-bay to see a used one for $5.  Worth it

Jeff
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smfulle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Nov. 2018 at 4:06pm
Nice tip Jeff.

i was thinking something more like the end of an orange juice can. It fit's more with my Bubba designed paint scheme. Your solution is much classier. 
Stan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ndnchf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Nov. 2018 at 4:08pm
Originally posted by Jeff_Davis Jeff_Davis wrote:

If you cut a hole in your tunnel cover for removal of the transfer case shift lever pin (highly recommended!)  buy yourself a TC pin access panel cover that is used on the Willys M38.  They are punched from a thick piece of sheet metal, and have one fixing hole and one slotted hole that can be affixed with two sheet metal screws.  
Just loosen the two screws and slide the cover out of the way to access the pin.  
They'll even work to cover up the misshapen gash carved in the tunnel by a frustrated relative!
Here's a photo of my install:


The Military parts houses have them NOS for about $10 plus shipping.  Or just search for item #332899269201 on flea-bay to see a used one for $5.  Worth it

Jeff

How big a hole do you cut?  How about a pic with the cover open? Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeff_Davis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Nov. 2018 at 5:14pm
OK, now you've made me touch wrenches....    The simple answer is to make the hole smaller than your available cover.  It looks like I started with a 1.75" hole saw and then made some custom enhancements to actually be able to remove the pin.  A case of measure twice and cut once - make sure your hole lines up with the pin.  Or you will be spending some special time with a half round file.
I can tell you it is still fiddly putting the pin, levers and springs together through a small hole. Don't make the hole too small or it will be more difficult to put and take the assembly.


Now for Stan, I have done some special research, cuz I thought his OJ can lid suggestion was totally unworkable - why too small... and I was right!  To get proper hole coverage you need to go with a large can lid, like from a big can of peaches.  A standard can top might work, but why work with a couple of fingers in there when you can use a larger lid and get your hand in there and get some work done?
Jeff


Jeff
1947 Willys CJ2A Las Flores, Provinca de Buenos Aires, Argentina
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