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Springs - what we need to know and Jeep Lean

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willys54wagon View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote willys54wagon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Springs - what we need to know and Jeep Lean
    Posted: 21 Oct. 2019 at 3:45pm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EKhWOIvvZmo

Here is everything we need to know. Including how to paint and why you don't grease them..................

Edited by willys54wagon - 06 Nov. 2019 at 10:10am
Two jeeps on the road, one is close and the rest are dreams.
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Joe DeYoung View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Joe DeYoung Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Oct. 2019 at 10:14am
I took the time to watch the video this morning. Boy did I learn a lot. I highly recommend people watch this. Thanks for posting Steve!!
Joe DeYoung
to many jeeps, parts, and accessories to list here, but apparently enough to keep me in trouble with my wife.





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oldtime View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Oct. 2019 at 10:50am
Yes very informative video however I believe he is dead wrong concerning 1 point.
He states to never paint between the leafs. 
I have an old Willys publication which states that the original (Mather) springs were painted with a special graphite paint.
I for one will continue to paint a graphite mix paint between leafs on  all my leaf spring rebuilds.
When properly torqued, the spring center bolt will not loosen up.

IMHO the original Eaton springs used more frequently on later Jeep  vintages;
those were far inferior to the Mather springs.
Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
T98-A Rock Crawler using exclusive factory parts and Approved Special Equipment from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963)
Zero aftermarket parts

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ndnchf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Oct. 2019 at 11:57am
Very informative video.  It makes me wonder about the quality of the currently available CJ2A springs from Omix, Crown, Walck's etc.  Mine has a little bit of lean with the original springs.  Been thinking about getting a new set.
1948 CJ2A - It goes nowhere fast, but anywhere slow.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wheelie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Oct. 2019 at 7:19pm
Originally posted by ndnchf ndnchf wrote:

Very informative video.  It makes me wonder about the quality of the currently available CJ2A springs from Omix, Crown, Walck's etc.


Great article. Thank you for sharing it. It didn't take this article for me to question the quality of the off shore springs though. Have a set made or wait for some quality brand name aftermarket springs to turn up somewhere. 

Finally I have some evidence for my argument for hydraulic shocks. THANK YOU! I've had more than a few discussions about gas vs hydraulic shocks and I get get hassled for preferring the former. 


Edited by wheelie - 22 Oct. 2019 at 8:01pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldscot3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Oct. 2019 at 11:00pm
My cj2 has a substantial lean on the driver's side rear and I've been thinking about a new set of springs. After watching the vid I looked at Eaton's site... Jeepster only under Willys. So I'm wondering now also, are all of the available replacement springs junk?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ggordon49 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct. 2019 at 11:01am
With concern to quality, I was wondering if anyone has tried NOS M38 springs? I see these on ebay for the rear. There would be surface rust from storage but that's no big deal.... Maybe these would be a good alternative, I'm not sure?
Ship of Theseus - As years go by wooden parts begin to rot and are replaced by new. After a century, all of the parts have been replaced. Is the "restored" ship still the same object as the original?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stev Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct. 2019 at 12:35pm
ggordon49,

I have a set of those springs in the link you posted.  I am running three Crown springs and one of these 11 leaf springs (drivers rear) on our 1946 trail Jeep.  I put that 11 leaf spring on to stop the lean to the drivers side - which worked.  I was concerned that if I put 11 leaf springs on both side, I would lose some of the articulation.

If you get these springs, you will need to put a small sleeve into the hole as because the holes are just slightly to large than the stock CJ2A shackles.


Stev
1946 CJ2A Trail Jeep, 1948 CJ2A Lefty Restored
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ggordon49 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct. 2019 at 1:38pm
Originally posted by Stev Stev wrote:

ggordon49,

I have a set of those springs in the link you posted.  I am running three Crown springs and one of these 11 leaf springs (drivers rear) on our 1946 trail Jeep.  I put that 11 leaf spring on to stop the lean to the drivers side - which worked.  I was concerned that if I put 11 leaf springs on both side, I would lose some of the articulation.

If you get these springs, you will need to put a small sleeve into the hole as because the holes are just slightly to large than the stock CJ2A shackles.




Thanks Stev! I can manage the sleeve, so I may try these out... I appreciate the feed back , thanks again.
Ship of Theseus - As years go by wooden parts begin to rot and are replaced by new. After a century, all of the parts have been replaced. Is the "restored" ship still the same object as the original?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldscot3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct. 2019 at 2:10pm
Walck's site says their springs are USA made, "not foreign junk that will sag in a few years". They are also $145 vs aprox $100 that other vendors are selling springs for. 

I guess I'd pay the difference if Walck's truly is the only quality product for sale.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rocnroll Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Oct. 2019 at 2:18pm
Originally posted by Stev Stev wrote:

I put that 11 leaf spring on to stop the lean to the drivers side - which worked. 


Stev, glad to know that worked for you. I have been considering the very same thing for 'lefty lean'.

Good to know it made a difference, thanks.


'47 CJ2A PU
'48 CJ2A Lefty

"Common sense is not that common"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote willys54wagon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Nov. 2019 at 8:42pm
Just put the cj away for the winter and as I walked away I looked back and thought I saw the "lean". Measured it and I have a 2 inch dif. Only 6,000 miles on the springs. New springs solved it back then. Don't remember if they were made locally or from walcks.

Springs and twisted frames are the cause of the lean if I remember right?

I know I have gained weight the last few years and my wife has lost some............... going to have to feed her more?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rocnroll Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Nov. 2019 at 9:12pm
Originally posted by willys54wagon willys54wagon wrote:


Springs and twisted frames are the cause of the lean if I remember right?



Plus there is more weight on the drivers' side....and on a Lefty even MORE weight.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Greaser007 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Nov. 2019 at 11:40pm
   I have to chime-in on this thread:

   I made it as far as the guy saying we should have 1-inch of travel.
That is where I learned he was talking street machines. I stopped there.

   My experience and observations back in the early '80's navigating the Rubicon jeep Trail was the hot-ticket Rancho Lift Springs. What a joke for articulation. Those rancho's would have qualified for that YouTube video with no-compression and about 1-inch of droop at best.
   I like the stock flexy springs and I keep mine oiled with WD-40 for good smooth and even flex.
   I like the idea of the graphite imbedded paint.

   Yep, I've owned a Corvette with 1-inch travel suspension and the car was like riding in a buck-board.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HotBox Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Nov. 2019 at 11:00am
Well.... some years back I took my leafs apart, painted with enamel paint... threw on a light coating of sodium soap grease and called it good. So far so good bit I'll let y'all know if theres any changes
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote willys54wagon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Nov. 2019 at 11:50pm
Found this on the cj3b site from good old doc vern. anyone remember him?


I found the Service Bulletin I mentioned yesterday. It was from
1971, but other than specific part numbers it should be applicable to
any Jeep model before that.

It said that any lean less than 3/4" was considered normal. The
measurements were taken from the body to a level surface, such as a
concrete pad. If the lean was over 1.5", new springs were required.
If the lean was between 3/4" and 1.5", spacers could be used under
the spring perches on the high side.

The spacer was 1/2" thick and had a hole drilled through the center
to fit over the index pin sticking up from the leaf pack. The pin
protruded only about 1/4" above the spring pack, so there was a
remaining 1/4" left at the top of the spacer. A short pin was
inserted here, to mate with the receptacle in the spring perch above
to keep everything aligned. It might make more sense to fabricate a
longer replacement pin than to mess with a little extension piece.

Longer U-bolts were specified, but if you already have an extra 1/2"
of threads you should be all right.

You could even do a little math and determine exactly how thick the
spacer should be, instead of taking a guess with 1/2". Measure the
body side to side and determine how much of a lean exists for that
width. Keeping the same ratio, determine how thick the spacer should
be for the width between the spring perches instead.


Regards,

Dr. Vern
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldscot3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Nov. 2019 at 8:11pm
mine has about 1 1/4" in four feet which is about 1 1/2" all the way across. My old parts jeep, however, doesn't seem to have much if any. I may try those springs on mine before I buy new ones. I just can't decide whether to use both or just take my left side off and put the parts jeep right side there.

Edited by oldscot3 - 05 Nov. 2019 at 8:14pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ol' Unreliable Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Nov. 2019 at 11:34pm
Originally posted by willys54wagon willys54wagon wrote:

Found this on the cj3b site from good old doc vern. anyone remember him?


Ah, good ol' Dr. Vern.  I sure miss the info he had available.  Wonder what he's up to these days...
There's a reason it's called Ol' Unreliable
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