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Supersonic rebuild |
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Agas46cj 
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Joined: 09 July 2022 Location: 17569 Status: Offline Points: 267 |
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 Posted: 06 Aug. 2022 at 7:00am |
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I got the head off
     after 7 hours of persuasion with aluminum wedges. So far I’ve found the bores measure 3.163 to 3.165 on the ring ridge. So I’m .040 over already from a previous rebuild. There’s a healthy ring ridge I need to ream out and then I can get the pistons out to check. Plenty of carbon, no steam blasting. No burning between cylinders. The exhaust valves wiggle in their guides a little. Seats look ok preliminary, I haven’t pulled the valves, just rotated the engine and looked. I see no markings on the piston tops, but they could be carboned over. If I end up finding too much that I think it needs re-machined is there enough bore left? My cj rebuilders manual says max overbore of .040 but I see pistons available up to .080. As it stands now I’m leaning towards rings, pistons, connecting rod bolts, studs, copper head gasket to get it back to running. That’s if the rod bearings look ok. The valve guides could stand to be replaced but I’m on the fence with that one. Not sure if it can be done in vehicle and if it can’t be re-machined I don’t see the point, and if it can I may just save that for when I do a pull and total rebuild. I don’t hate it as much being an ss now that I’ve cleaned the grease off and saw some of its guts. This is an improvement. Edited by Agas46cj - 06 Aug. 2022 at 7:45am |
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Mark W.
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Sponsor Member Joined: 09 Nov. 2014 Location: Silverton, OR Status: Offline Points: 7982 |
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Posted: 06 Aug. 2022 at 8:21am |
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My Pistons are .060 over. |
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Agas46cj
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Joined: 09 July 2022 Location: 17569 Status: Offline Points: 267 |
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Posted: 07 Aug. 2022 at 4:19pm |
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I’ve taken some bore measurements with a dial bore gauge. At the lip it measures 3.163 - 3.165 the front and back are 163 and the 2 middle are 165. The wear right below the rind ridge it’s the worst spot for wear at .015 and tapers in quick in about an 1/8 and then comes in and stays a pretty consistent.004-.007 bigger than the 3.165 or 3.163 respectively. The wear is hourglass shaped with a trumpet top if that helps visualize. I would like to know if this is a good candidate for a ring replacement and valve overhaul? Or is the wear too great for a new set of rings to seal?
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Oldpappy
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Joined: 09 Apr. 2018 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 4908 |
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Posted: 07 Aug. 2022 at 4:52pm |
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Were it mine, with that much taper in the bores I would not consider it a candidate for such an overhaul, I would consider it as needing a rebuild.
I think it needs to be bored. I don't mind going .060 over on these, have seen plenty bored that far, and they ran fine. While they do indeed sell pistons .080, I would have one sleeved before going that much oversized.
Edited by Oldpappy - 07 Aug. 2022 at 4:54pm |
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If you can't get there in a Jeep you don't need to be there!
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cpt logger
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Posted: 07 Aug. 2022 at 11:50pm |
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Since those numbers are beyond my shop's service limits, I would go whole hog on this engine. I do not recommend using those bores as is. If You just need it to get by for a few months...Maybe. But considering the time & $$ for this patch job, nah...fix it once. New everything, bearings, pistons, seals, gaskets, exhaust valves, lifters, & oil pump. If it cleans up at 0.040, I would use new oversized pistons. Otherwise, I wold sleeve it back to STD. Be sure to check both the crank & cam shafts journals for sizes, Oor, taper, & cam condition. Check the crankshaft seal journals as well. Redo the valve train also. I would install valve seat inserts at this time, I am paranoid that way. Spending your time and money is way fun!
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Agas46cj
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Joined: 09 July 2022 Location: 17569 Status: Offline Points: 267 |
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Posted: 08 Aug. 2022 at 8:21am |
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Got the pistons all out today and bearing 2 has some galling and a groove in it, there’s also a matching groove in the crank. Looks like I have to get re machined for sure. I was 80% sure I was going to, I really considered using my lisle 15000 hone to open it up to .050 over and using the jmp .050 pistons from Ron Fitzpatrick. I found the matching Hastings rings on summit. But no more.
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Mark W.
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Posted: 08 Aug. 2022 at 9:12am |
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My engine is .060" over with no problems what so ever.
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Chug A Lug
1948 2A Body Customized 1949 3A W/S 1957 CJ5 Frame Modified Late 50's 134L 9.25"clutch T90A D18 (1.25") D44/30 flanged E-Locker D25 5.38 Since 1962 |
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Oldpappy
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Posted: 08 Aug. 2022 at 9:58am |
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I have two engines I am getting ready to build which will need to be bored .060 over which I am okay with, but as I already said if one is worn more than that I would have it sleeved and bored standard.
One of those two is a Supersonic block which had a Willys head on it. No way you could "open it up to .050" accurately with a cylinder hone, especially with that much taper in the bores.
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If you can't get there in a Jeep you don't need to be there!
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dasvis
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Posted: 08 Aug. 2022 at 10:07am |
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+1
Waste of time
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1947 CJ2A #88659 "Rat Patrol"
1953 CJ3A #453-GB1 11266 "Black Beauty" 1964 Thunderbird convertible ..... & one of them moves under it's own power!! |
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Agas46cj
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Joined: 09 July 2022 Location: 17569 Status: Offline Points: 267 |
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Posted: 08 Aug. 2022 at 10:11am |
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I
 no worries about me bubba honing it with my giant lisle 15000. I called a machine shop with my numbers and findings. Looks like about 8-900 to get it bored, honed, decked, valves, and ground. Kills my budget and hopes for other things for it for the year, but it will be a mostly brand new engine with lots more life than a ring job. Gonna rebuild the transmission while it’s apart too. I talked to the shop about the hardened seats for the exhaust and he talked me out of it. He said with the low temp of it and if it ever runs lean I’ll just chip the seat out. Looks like it was orange originally if you looks behind the flywheel. What color was the ss motor?Edited by Agas46cj - 08 Aug. 2022 at 10:13am |
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Oldpappy
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Posted: 09 Aug. 2022 at 9:57am |
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Just about every L134 I have ever pulled was painted that red oxide looking color behind the flywheel regardless of the color used on the visible parts of the block.
Most CJ engines I have had appear to have been black originally. WW2 Willys MB were OD, Ford GPW grey. The Supersonic block in my barn showed signs of green paint like yours under the crud before the block was cleaned, but I don't know if that was the original color for the engines used in the cars. It is your Jeep so you can paint the engine any color you want. I would probably paint it black or grey. Edited by Oldpappy - 09 Aug. 2022 at 10:02am |
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If you can't get there in a Jeep you don't need to be there!
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Agas46cj
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Posted: 16 Aug. 2022 at 2:20pm |
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Just got a call from machine shop. Magnaflux revealed cracks between cylinders and a crack in the crank. Very sad. So I am now in need of an engine. I have a supersonic cylinder head and nos cam I can add to a deal to buy one off someone.
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oldscot3
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Posted: 16 Aug. 2022 at 4:39pm |
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Some cracks in the block can be repaired. Metalshaper has vid on the process. Maybe all you need is a crank.
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James 4:6 God resists the proud, but gives grace to the humble.
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Agas46cj
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Posted: 16 Aug. 2022 at 6:02pm |
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They’re in the deck. 1 between cylinders and a few more originating from exhaust valves
I watched the metalshaper video on pinning. I’ll see if they’re willing to try it, or if they’re willing to machine if I try it. Any idea where to get pin kits? Edited by Agas46cj - 16 Aug. 2022 at 6:36pm |
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Tom in RI
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Posted: 16 Aug. 2022 at 9:10pm |
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Cracks in the deck are common - perfectly repairable. Machine shop has a “guy” that repairs blocks and heads with Lock-n-stitch. My GPW block had deck cracks, cracks under the distributor and a crack in the distributor tunnel. Fixed 25 years ago and going strong. The repairs were not expensive.
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Agas46cj
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Posted: 17 Aug. 2022 at 9:07am |
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So I got my block. 3 cracks. After making many calls and watching a few videos it’s not so bad. I however cannot find anyone to fix it nor get anyone recommended to me that does. Means I’m gonna have to do it myself. The machine shop did say that if I do pin it he would machine it. He would recommend sleeving the cylinder that has the crack after I pin it. Where do it get a pin kit? Or, does anyone know someone who would fix it? The crank is cracked at 2 rod journals right in the corner. I assume that that is not repairable?
   
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Jeff J
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Posted: 17 Aug. 2022 at 10:49am |
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For the block:
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Oldpappy
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Posted: 17 Aug. 2022 at 10:51am |
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It is getting hard to find a good full service machine shop around here too. The one I have mainly used for 40 years is probably about to go out of business since the owner died a couple of weeks ago, and the only other one around here that was staffed and equipped for full service went out of business a couple of years ago. Cracks in the deck like those can be repaired, but I would also want the cylinders sleeved, and new valve seats installed. |
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