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T18 transmission help

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hotrod59 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 24 June 2020 at 11:35pm
I recently put a Ford T18 transmission in my Jeep. I used a USA standard rebuild kit and a novak adapter kit to adapt to the spicer 18 transfer case. Once everything was installed and running, 2nd gear is hard to shift into. I have checked the clutch adjustment, and it’s ok. The shift forks look ok and don’t look bent. I was told that the 2nd gear synchro might be installed incorrectly? Below are a couple of pictures and a video of what it’s doing and the synchro assembly for 2nd gear. Any help is appreciated.  


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JeepFever Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 June 2020 at 11:47pm
I can't help with issue,   but wanted to mention how cool it is to have a video to show what is going on.   That very clearly shows what is happening from the driver's point of view.

Good luck!   Hopefully someone here has a simple fix.

Oh,  you are going to love the combination of granny low and Dauntless, once you get it sorted out.  :-)


Edited by JeepFever - 24 June 2020 at 11:49pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Willys Motors Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 June 2020 at 11:49pm
Looks like the springs on your synchro blocking plates are out of place at the very least. Are you sure the 1-2 synchronizer hub isn't in backwards?
Looks very different than my T98 anyway

Edited by Willys Motors - 24 June 2020 at 11:57pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hotrod59 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 June 2020 at 11:52pm
Originally posted by Willys Motors Willys Motors wrote:

Looks like the springs on your synchro blocking plates are out of place at the very least. Are you sure the 1-2 synchronizer hub isn't in backwards?
I really don’t know. I can’t find a picture or diagram anywhere of the synchro. I am fairly sure it’s right?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Willys Motors Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 June 2020 at 12:07am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hotrod59 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 June 2020 at 12:08am
Originally posted by Willys Motors Willys Motors wrote:

http://www.fordification.com/tech/images/T18.jpg

Is this it?
No that is not it. That is a early version of the T18. I have a later version. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 June 2020 at 7:55pm
Hmmm.
Hard to say without the ability to see it. 
But here’s s couple of possibilities.
The synchro hub and sleeve should have been marked prior to disassembly.
So ‘m guessing that was not done and the synchro hub/ sleeve clocking is now mis-aligned.
Another problem sometimes occurs because the quality of the spring under the synchronizer plates is way overly stiff with some after market rebuild kits.
That could effect the motion of the synchro plate along the synchro hub.
No doubt that other less common possibilities do exist.
Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 June 2020 at 9:19pm
I suggest you put trans into neutral and remove the shift tower.
Then note position of shift forks and make sure all gears are in neutral.
Shift it into second by hand.
You should be able to see if something like the synchro plates are binding or whatever the problem may be.
If it shifts smoothly by hand then the problem must be in the shift tower.
Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hotrod59 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2020 at 11:18am
Originally posted by oldtime oldtime wrote:

The synchro hub and sleeve should have been marked prior to disassembly.
So ‘m guessing that was not done and the synchro hub/ sleeve clocking is now mis-aligned.

I did mark the hub/sleeve when is was disassembled and re-installed in the same position. I also did not replace the retaining spring. The shift hub/sleeve moves by hand with the shift tower off. I did not disassemble the shift tower and nothing appears bent/broken in the sift tower. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2020 at 11:33am
Sounds right to me.
But in your second pic things don’t look right to me.
Notice how the blocking ring is fully exposed ? 
That just looks wrong. 
I no longer have my Borg Warner catalog covering the post 1979 T18’s so....
Let me go an take s pic of my pre 1979 version....


Edited by oldtime - 26 June 2020 at 11:38am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hotrod59 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2020 at 11:40am
Originally posted by oldtime oldtime wrote:

Sounds right to me.
But in your second pic things don’t look right to me.
Notice how the blocking ring is fully exposed ? 
That just looks wrong. 
I no longer have my Borg Warner catalog covering the post 1979 T18’s so....
Let me go an take s pic of my pre 1979 version....
That would be great. I have the collar shifted as far back as possible, thats why everything is exposed. Im about to order a new hub/gear/synchro assembly. I would like to try and avoid that. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2020 at 12:31pm
Here you see the rear synchro assembly fully engaged into the synchronized gear that I prefer to call 1st gear.
(not in low gear)

Here you see the transmission fully shifted into neutral.

Here you see the outer sleeve moved all the way to the rear of case where it normally is not shifted. It’s only positioned here for reference so you can see the the placement of blocking plates inside the synchro hub and fitment of the blocking ring.


Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
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Zero aftermarket parts

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2020 at 12:36pm
In your pic the bronze blocking ring is not up inside the synchronizer sleeve as it should be on “all” Borg Warner transmissions.

Edited by oldtime - 26 June 2020 at 12:51pm
Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
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Zero aftermarket parts

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Willys Motors Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2020 at 12:58pm
Ken, I ABSOLUTELY agree with your diagnosis.
I didn't mention that because I can't figure out where to extra 1/4 in axial slop came from that allowed all the parts to go together without that blocking ring fully seated.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2020 at 1:06pm
Here is an excerpt covering that specific portion of re-assembly as taken from the 1972 technical service manual........
From the rear of the main shaft, install second speed gear rear snap ring, blocking ring, second speed synchronizer unit and snap ring. NOTE: Second speed synchronizer sleeve shift fork groove must be towards rear of main shaft

Yes Willys Motors not sure how he was able to assemble it like that. But I recall helping a guy redo his T 90 for virtually the same problem. Blocking ring was not up inside the synchro sleeve.... 
On the T90 I seem to recall that the synchro hub assembly was put onto  the mainshaft backwards or something like that.
So yeah I’m thinking the synchro hub may be reversed...
Also note too how his synchro plates are way out ahead of the synchro hub. That just can’t work like that.


Edited by oldtime - 26 June 2020 at 1:26pm
Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
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Zero aftermarket parts

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hotrod59 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2020 at 2:23pm
Thank you for the information. I found this video on youtube, the man is disassembling a main-shaft. If you look at the 11:25 mark he slides the gear off and it looks like how mine is assembled. I dont think it is assembled incorrectly.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2020 at 2:44pm
I glanced at the video and I sure did not see it was ever assembled the way that yours is.
Take it for what it’s worth but I’m virtually positive that your synchronizer hub was put backwards onto the main shaft.
The only trouble on my end is that I cannot see enough detail of your hub because the synchro sleeve covers over it.
Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
T98-A Rock Crawler using exclusive factory parts and Approved Special Equipment from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963)
Zero aftermarket parts

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote hotrod59 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2020 at 3:56pm
This is what I am seeing in the video. There you can clearly see the gap between the hub and brass ring. I dont know if the one he is tearing down in the video is correct but it looks the same as how mine is set up.
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