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T90/D18 Rebuild

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cal.bar View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cal.bar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 June 2017 at 9:49pm
Having now done (and redone) my trans AND my T/C, I have found that NONE of the supposedly "go to" videos to rebuild these units is actually complete.  Every one I have yet seen skips steps or parts or doesn't show you the proper measurements.  The Novak instructions mention the endplay, but don't highlight it, show any pictures, or suggest procedures as to how to measure that endplay.  Considering how important it is, I would have hoped for more detail on that process from Novak.
 
In the end, before you rebuild the Trans or T?C watch ALL available videos, read the instructions (such as they are) and of course.... ask LOTS of questions of the great folks here on the board.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Speedy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 June 2017 at 12:36am
Pjensen 
great pictorial. 

Cal.bar, exactly what you said is the proper way to approach every rebuild. 

if I can (I should be able) I will make an update video to link in mine to save others down the road.
anyone suggest any revisions, I think this one above is huge.
I will try.
- Mike
47 CJ2A - Warn OD, Ramsey PT1-J/Koenig 100,Arctic top,Dana 44 30 spline full float with disc's,Dana 30 with discs, 2.5 lift, Saginaw power steering, dual master cylinder
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wadoyado Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 June 2017 at 1:43am
Originally posted by Overland Overland wrote:

Got the boxes out





I never was able to remove the transfer case shift lever pivot pin.  In the following picture, is it the etched circle?  A bit hard to see but it's there.



I pounded on this with a punch and drift a bit, no movement.  I ended up chopping the tub some, but I don't feel all that bad because once I get to fixing the body that will be the least of my problems.

     My shift pin wouldn't budge either had to take a propane torch to warm the case around the pin, a little heat made a big difference also the trans was separated from the TC.....switching gears your crossmember looks like you weren't running a skid plate? I think I have an extra if you need it and I'm in G.R. Joe Wadoyado
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the jeep you've been driving all your life" (Mickey Mantle paraphrase)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Overland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 June 2017 at 1:33am
Originally posted by wadoyado wadoyado wrote:

... your crossmember looks like you weren't running a skid plate? I think I have an extra if you need it and I'm in G.R. Joe Wadoyado


Didn't even know there was supposed to be a skid plate there.  Will PM, thanks.

---------------------------------------


Awesome info all around, keep it up!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 June 2017 at 7:50pm
Originally posted by Overland Overland wrote:


Didn't even know there was supposed to be a skid plate there.  Will PM, thanks.


Oh yeah! I have one here that is functional. but not pretty. Yours for the shipping cost.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Overland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 June 2017 at 1:41am
So I'm in the middle of disassembly.  There is no oil collector. 

Is this piece non-critical?  Why would a person remove it?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote clayvt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 June 2017 at 1:47am
for what it's worth, I followed "metalshaper" on YouTube for the rebuilding of my t90 and d18. He never mentioned endplay in the tranny and as of now w/ 500 miles on it I haven't had any issues. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mbullism Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 June 2017 at 4:07am
Originally posted by Overland Overland wrote:

So I'm in the middle of disassembly.  There is no oil collector. 

Is this piece non-critical?  Why would a person remove it?

The "oil collector" comes into play with an open front bearing when running long grades uphill where the oil level runs back, low at the front.  It's perfectly fine to remove it with a permanently sealed front bearing, or if you only run downhill or level with an open bearing.... #sarcasm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cal.bar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 June 2017 at 6:56pm
Originally posted by clayvt clayvt wrote:

for what it's worth, I followed "metalshaper" on YouTube for the rebuilding of my t90 and d18. He never mentioned endplay in the tranny and as of now w/ 500 miles on it I haven't had any issues. 

 
Congratulations, you got lucky.  Without measuring the endplay, it's just a crapshoot if the trans will fall out of second or not.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Overland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 June 2017 at 7:48pm
So teardown is complete... except for the reverse idler shaft and gear.  I can't get it to budge with a drift and hammer, and I can't figure a way to press it out.  (maybe someone smarter than me has a way) I believe you want to force the shaft OUT of the case, NOT IN, due to the end of the shaft with the notch having a slightly larger diameter.

Can I leave it in during the cleaning/degreasing process?  I'd hate to have the gear seize on the shaft.

If it has to come out, what's my next step?  I assume it would be to bust out the oxy/ace torch (or the propane torch?) and heat the area on the outside of the case around the shaft.  I don't want to compromise the case obviously.  Do I make it cherry red like I would on a bolt?

Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SE Kansas 46 CJ-2A Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 June 2017 at 8:21pm
Not cherry red! The Problem is that the shaft can't be hit with a drift with a straight on approach. The gear should be out of the case to make a thorough cleaning job and to make sure their is no grit in the interior of the gear. There is a bronze bushing in the gear that could be damaged by too much heat in the vicinity of the gear. Once you can get the shaft to move, it will come out. I have in the past used a flat face long drift to budge it with some success, but if that fails and you have a press, you can put a flat bar that is long enough to clear the top of the case and support it on the end. Put a piece of metal smaller than the diameter of the shaft between the bar and the shaft and press on the bar. Make sure that the other end of the shaft can travel out of the case when you set your press job up. It shouldn't take a lot of pressure to push the shaft out of the case.

When you put the gear and shaft back in the case, make sure to orient the shaft like it was when it came out so the lock plate will fit properly.

Hope this helps.

Edited by SE Kansas 46 CJ-2A - 24 June 2017 at 8:24pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Overland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 June 2017 at 10:19pm
Thanks for the advice SE_Kansas.

I finally completed disassembly.



I tried everything I could think of to get the reverse idler shaft out.  Heat up the case a bit and pound, I tried a crossbar setup with my press and was afraid my drift and crowbar would snap.  They were bending quite a bit without the shaft moving.

Ultimately I probably committed a mortal sin but I got it out.  I heated the outside of the case around the shaft and pressed the shaft into the case about an inch, then I heated the inner portion holding the shaft and pressed the shaft the rest of the way out.  I know this is backwards but I couldn't find a way to do it any other way.

The inner bushing of the reverse idler gear looks a little worse for the wear, but the holes themselves in the case appear fine (to the eye).  I got the calipers out ("in) once it cooled down and took some measurements.

Reverse idler shaft:

notched end:  0.750

other end: 0.747

Case holes:

Outter:  0.747

Inner:  0.736

Do these measurements seem ok?

Also can I just press the bushing out of the reverse idler gear and replace it?  The gear itself seems fine to me.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pjensen641 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 June 2017 at 11:00pm
Dang, if the gear looks fine and there wan't much for bushing play, you might have gotten by without touching the reverse gear.

You might see how much the bushing is from Novak or Debella.  Honestly, I recall the reverse gear (with bearing) and shaft NOS from Debella was pretty reasonable.  Might be worth just replacing.

I think I said this before, but its worth repeating.  If there is any wear on the cluster gear shaft, buy that shaft ONLY from Novak.  I tested the hardness of two other replacement shafts and they were not up to spec (Even the NOS one from Debella!).  Same goes for the D18 intermediate shaft, I would only source from Novak.  Other sources may or may not have the correct heat treat, and that is critical for bearing surfaces.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Overland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 June 2017 at 11:19pm
So general advice questions.

I'd like to prep and paint the cases since I'm going through all this effort.

Is getting the cases media blasted the best way to prep them?  I don't have that equipment and would have to take it to a shop.  For now I have just done pressure washing.

When I paint what do you guys suggest?  Long-lasting protection is my first priority.

Thanks
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Overland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 July 2017 at 9:59pm
So in Rick's video he states that the nub on the main gear should be 0.726, anything less than 0.725 indicates a bad gear.

I just want to double check that this is correct.  My main gear seems fine in all respects except I measured the numb (several times with caliper and micrometer) at 0.626.  Do I absolutely have to replace then?  Will it ride poorly in the clutch or something?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote wadoyado Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 July 2017 at 1:10am
Hey, fellow Michigander, If your talking about the main drive gear that goes into the pilot bushing on the fly wheel... I just checked two, both measure .625 5/8 in. I'm not sure what vid your talking about but I think he's talking about something else. I've only done one T-90 so I'm by no means an expert. I'm still in my Rookie year but one thing I've learned, correct terminology is very important. Joe Wadoyado
"It's unbelievable how much you don't know about the jeep you've been driving all your life" (Mickey Mantle paraphrase)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Overland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 July 2017 at 3:15am
Thanks Joe,

I meant the main drive input shaft gear



Rick talks about the stub diameter at 5:00 in this video and says .726, not .6xx

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZV5QOL9uzHI&t=17s

Any and all input is always welcome.

Thanks!

-Dave
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mbullism Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 July 2017 at 12:18pm
Rick mispoke...  0.626 on the shaft, 0.628 on the pilot bushing
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