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Wheel Modifications

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jpet View Drop Down
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    Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 10:00am
Hi all,

I'm moving the talk about changing wheel shells on a KH wheel to a new thread since it is turning into a technical session and also to comply with the rules for posting in the "Wanted to Buy" section. Here is the old thread:

16 inch wheels

Originally posted by Phil_IA Phil_IA wrote:


Jeff, if you're looking for blank rims, I found them at Hey Wheel www.heywheel.com. They have 16X4.5 through 16X10. Install your own centers. Prices look reasonable to me. I've got a set of rusted out 4.5s that I plan to use in 16X6 blanks some time.


I checked with Heywheel. Their 16" shells, or "rims", have a 13.48 inside diameter. This is the same as common conventional 16" wheels have and the same as the trailer wheels that I purchased.

I have disassembled three KH 16 x 4.5 wheels. (all had rusted out rims).



it turns out that the outside of the centers are cone shaped. It tapers from 13-5/8" up to 13-3/4"



..... the old rim appears to be tapered at the drop center as well.

... so just be advised, it's not as simple as just switching out the centers and welding them in.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rocnroll Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 10:41am
Originally posted by jpet jpet wrote:


... so just be advised, it's not as simple as just switching out the centers and welding them in.


If it was easy everybody would have them! Big smile Wink




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jeeper50 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 10:52am
"pay no attention to the man behind the curtain" is what I'm thinking as I follow this thread, as all your other projects have turned out so awesome.
 
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'46 CJ2A Barnfind project, rear PTO drum pulley, original paint, front 11" brakes.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 11:00am
So Jeff how does the gauge of the original standard 4-1/2" KH disk's compare to the gauge of your new 6" wide rims ?
You wanna talk wheel set ? 
I discovered a engineering anomaly or oversight that may be of interest you.



Edited by oldtime - 04 Jan. 2018 at 11:05am
Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
T98-A Rock Crawler using factory parts from the Willys Motors era (1953-1963)

http://s4.zetaboards.com/CJ3B_Bulletin_Board/topic/30228766/1/#new
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 11:31am
Originally posted by oldtime oldtime wrote:

So Jeff how does the gauge of the original standard 4-1/2" KH disk's compare to the gauge of your new 6" wide rims ?....
These wheels measure .170 thick. They also have safety humps

Edit: the shells you buy from Hey Wheel do not have safety humps.

Edited by jpet - 04 Jan. 2018 at 5:18pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oldtime Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 12:01pm
A little off topic but something else to think about.......

Regardless of specific wheel,  all factory universal type jeep wheels have a 3/4" disk inset.
This simply means that the drum mounting surface of the wheel disk is 3/4" outward of rim center.
By comparison If one goes to a centerlined disk  having zero offset then the disk will at center of the outer rim section.

So eventually I got to wondering why the engineers decided upon 3/4" inset as the standard.
Obviously the 3/4" inset creates no steering angle issues so long as tires remain under 30" tall at 6" wide tread.
If the tread is wider or the tire diameter increases then a standard jeep will begin to have tire / leaf spring interference at full turn.

So obviously having less wheel inset is better if tires are taller or the tread width increases.

But still why did they decide upon 3/4" of inset ?

Eventually I started taking hub, drum, spindle and wheel bearing measurements.
I determined that if the rim were to spin at  true center between the two wheel bearings then the disk should ideally have a 3/8" inset relative to the rim.

3/8" disk inset made the best sense to me considering wheel bearing positions.
With 3/8" inset; standard size tire treads would  move slightly outward but still remain under the fenders.
Then a person might even go as big as 7.50 x 16"  tire without rubbing issues.
I expect 3/8" inset would also keep the 7" wide tread of a 7.50 x 16" tire under the fenders.

Of course that's  only true so long as you retain Dana 25 or Dana 27 axles..
Currently building my final F-134 powered 3B .
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http://s4.zetaboards.com/CJ3B_Bulletin_Board/topic/30228766/1/#new
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rocnroll Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 1:28pm








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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 1:33pm
Thanks Chad. I'm wondering if the inside diameter of your shells is 13-5/8" or even bigger.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rocnroll Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 2:21pm
    Almost worked up a sweat out there.....if it wasn't for this chill factor right now.   



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 48cj2a Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 4:52pm
man...its 12 degrees here!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lee (MN) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 6:35pm
Jeff, the trailer rims were blanks, or did you remove the centers ?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 7:03pm
I bought 4 wheels from eCustomRim.com

http://www.ecustomrim.com/trailer-rims/16/

2 wheel for $72.70 seems like a pretty good deal to me:



.... took me about 15 minutes to grind the welds and drive the center out. These shells are heavier than the originals and have safety humps.

Hopefully tomorrow, I will be able to turn a KH center down and put it in a shell.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lee (MN) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 7:47pm
Cool!, looking foreword to your progress!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smfulle Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Jan. 2018 at 10:13pm
Man, Grampa’s Jeep is going to look wimpy on his little old 7.00x16 tires sitting next to those giant things.
They might be better for the tire crawl poser shot though. They might stick out enough so we can get clear up on top.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jan. 2018 at 6:01am
The wheels in that picture are 5-3/4” wide. I might have to remove a fender .... and there is nothing “wimpy” about Grandpa’s Jeep
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jan. 2018 at 2:31pm






Now, I can set my inset to whatever I want ....



... or even reverse the shell for a wider stance:



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote berettajeep Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jan. 2018 at 3:28pm
You always do amazing work Jeff. I wish I had 1% of your talent, knowledge and skills!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jpet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jan. 2018 at 4:18pm
thanks Dennis, but it's all on YouTube. It's really not that hard but you need a lathe.

Here is a better pic of the wheel with the shell reversed:


I could gain 3" overall if I push it. ....Still debating

Edited by jpet - 05 Jan. 2018 at 4:26pm
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